The Shockley-Goldsby Debate: The Rest of the Story

Image credit: 1975 Corks & Curls

by James A. Bacon

In August The Cavalier Daily ignited a furor over Bert Ellis, a conservative businessman whom Governor Glenn Youngkin appointed to the University of Virginia Board of Visitors. In a lengthy article, the student newspaper detailed Ellis’ role, as a tri-committee chairman of the University Union, in bringing Nobel Prize winner William Shockley to the University for a debate about race and IQ.

Shockley’s views about Black intellectual inferiority have been broadly rejected by American society in the 47 years since Shockley went mano a mano with African-American biologist Richard Goldsby. But the event has been cited as the most damning of multiple reasons to demand Ellis’ resignation from the Board. As the UVa Student Council, the Democratic Party of Virginia and various media outlets have repeated the story, it has morphed into a narrative in which, to quote The Washington Post editorial board, Ellis “organized a campus talk” by a racist. No mention of a debate. No mention of Goldsby. No mention of the fact that Ellis was one of three student chairmen who ran the University Union.

Here’s what the narrative underplays or omits entirely: first, the University Union had reached out to local African-American groups in 1974 when planning the debate. Second, Ellis was one of three tri-chairmen who called the shots, although, as spokesman for the group, he was the only one quoted in The Cavalier Daily coverage of the controversy. Third, when the three tri-chairmen made the final decision, Ellis voted to cancel the debate. But he was in the minority, and he was overruled.

In sum, the portrayal of Ellis’ role in the controversy is so shorn of context that it amounts to character assassination. Here follows the full story:

William Shockley was widely acclaimed as the inventor of the transistor, an accomplishment for which he was awarded the 1956 Nobel Prize in physics. By the 1970s, he had turned his attention to the study of the inheritability of intelligence and its variability between the races. He propounded the view that Blacks had lower intelligence, on average, not due to environmental conditions but due to their genetic inheritance. This idea, though held by many, was hotly- contested. A series of debates had been organized, including one at Harvard University. The leaders of the University Union, the student-run group that organized major events, thought the topic would be of interest at UVa.

Harvard booked Roy Innes, a prominent African-American leader and director of the Congress of Racial Equality, to debate Shockley. The University Union wanted to replicate that format.

Before signing up Shockley and Innes, the University Union touched bases with two groups for feedback from UVa’s African-Americans. One was the Black Student Alliance, the other was the Minority Culture Committee. The idea was to schedule the event in February 1975 during Black Culture Week as a way to bring attention to that celebration.

Here is how, as quoted by the 1974 Cavalier Daily, Ellis remembered the interaction with Sheila Crider, Black Culture Week chairman: “She was asked as minority Culture Committee co-chairman to find out the black attitude towards the debate, and she reported that blacks would be in favor of them, book them.”

The Cavalier Daily also reported that Donald “Doc” Spell, Crider’s co-chairman, had agreed to the debate with the stipulation that someone other than Innes debate Shockley. He later came to oppose the debate in the face of “totally negative feedback” from Black students.

In an October 1974 letter to the CD, Crider denied that she had ever agreed to the debate. Yes, Ellis had reached out, but only to ask which date she preferred during Black Culture Week. “Ironic, isn’t it? To schedule a speaker on Black inferiority during a week dedicated to teaching Black achievement?” 

Whatever the degree of buy-in from Black student groups early in the process, the mood shifted. Harvard students denounced the invitation to Shockley, and the debate there was canceled. For reasons unexplained in The Cavalier Daily coverage at the time — perhaps Spell’s insistence — Innes dropped out of the picture. As awareness of the upcoming event spread in the early fall of 1974, Black students at UVa began expressing vehement opposition. 

The Cavalier Daily referred vaguely to “negotiations” between Ellis and Black student leaders but provided no details. Reading between the lines of the CD articles, Ellis was in a tight spot. As he said at the time, “Business-wise, you can’t sign contracts for a debate and three months later cancel. The agencies won’t stand for it.” He tried to find a solution that Black students could live with. One option mentioned more than once was to reschedule the debate so it did not coincide with Black Culture Week.

As the controversy unfolded, Ellis wavered. He asked the Student Council to give an advisory opinion. After what was described as a contentious, two-hour debate, Student Council voted 13 to 11 to advise the University Union to not hold the debate. Opponents declared Shockley’s views to be abhorrent and an insult to the Blacks attending UVa. Proponents generally took the tack that the UVa community should respect freedom of speech and be willing to hear unpopular viewpoints.

The Cavalier Daily quoted Ellis as saying that he would probably stand by the Council’s recommendation.

However, Ellis was not the final decision-maker. As The Cavalier Daily reported:

The Union’s other Tri-Chairmen, Rick Kruger and Mary Dudley, said last night they will vote to retain the debate. This will offset Mr. Ellis’ vote and send the issue to the Union’s 22 co-chairmen, elected at large by the Union, for a decision.

As The Cavalier Daily had foretold, the University Union did, in fact, determine to hold the debate despite the Council’s recommendation. The Student Union co-chairmen voted by a decisive margin to forge ahead. However, the newspaper’s reporting provided seemingly contradictory descriptions of Ellis’ actions. First this:

Citing the Union’s efforts to go through proper channels in getting black opinion, the effects of a precedent cancelling a controversial debate, and the fact that such a debate would be an academic exercise, Union Tri-Chairman and Spokesman Bert Ellis urged the Co-[Chairmen] to not cancel the debate.

Then three paragraphs later:

Though Mr. Ellis did vote to cancel the debate, the Union’s other Tri-Chairman, Rick Kruger and Mary Dudley, voted to retain the debate. This sent the decision to the Union’s 22 co-chairmen, elected at large by the Union, for a decision.

Perhaps Ellis felt honor-bound to live up to his promise to cast a vote in the University Union consistent with the Student Council’s recommendation, even if he did not personally agree with it. When asked about his stance back then, Ellis today tells Bacon’s Rebellion, “At one point I said, maybe we should just cancel it.” But seeing himself as a team player, he continued to speak, as spokesman, for the team.

Preparations for the debate proceeded, and the controversy faded from the pages of The Cavalier Daily. Wanting someone “formidable” to take on Shockley, the University Union recruited Goldsby, an African-American Amherst university professor and author of a 1971 book, “Race and Races.”

The debate was held in February 1975. The Cavalier Daily published a short front-page article that devoted several paragraphs to Shockley’s statements and only two to Goldsby’s. 

In Ellis’ recollection, Goldsby demolished Shockley, just as the debate organizers hoped he would. In his mind, the debate served to discredit Shockley’s racist premises. I reached out last week to Kruger, the behind-the-scenes champion of the event to see if he shared Ellis’ view, but he declined to respond to my email. In reviewing the CD archives, I could find no letters to the editor commenting on the debate one way or the other. One thing can be said for certain: the controversy over Shockley died and remained buried for 47 years until The Cavalier Daily resurrected it this August.


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39 responses to “The Shockley-Goldsby Debate: The Rest of the Story”

  1. f/k/a_tmtfairfax Avatar
    f/k/a_tmtfairfax

    “The Washington Post editorial board, Ellis “organized a campus talk” by a racist. No mention of a debate. No mention of Goldsby. No mention of the fact that Ellis was one of three student chairmen who ran the University Union.” No difference between the Post and Pravda. Acknowledging facts and addressing them is not necessary when there’s an axe to grind.

    Irrespective of the merits of a controversy, all the facts should be put forth. Winning on the merits is unnecessary when the Post can hide facts.

    Keep in mind that I was told twice that my op-ed pointing out the high cost overweight trucks placed on taxpayers should be a part of the plan to raise more money for transportation was inconsistent with the views of the editorial board and, as such, would not be published. Stalin would be proud.

  2. Might want to tread lightly with the ‘team player’ defense. I’m not sure that will win hearts and minds. Maybe acknowledge the end may not, for many, have justified the means and then move on is a better idea.

  3. LarrytheG Avatar
    LarrytheG

    I think the idea of having a black person debate and defend the idea that blacks are not inferior is really unseemly and borders on actually giving credibility to
    a racist concept that it should not have from the get go.

    It’s a awful premise from the start.

    1. f/k/a_tmtfairfax Avatar
      f/k/a_tmtfairfax

      Agreed, but the Post still should have reported all the facts. Leaving out Goldsby and calling a debate a talk would have resulted in a journalism student flunking the assignment. But it’s high journalism for the Post.

      1. LarrytheG Avatar
        LarrytheG

        Didn’t other media also report?

        looks to me to be a matter of opinion on the “talk”/”debate” unless I’m missing something.

        I don’t think WaPo is a paragon of unbiased reporting – by a long shot – but the fact that you guys KEEP reading it and keep talking about them makes me wonder if you really have walked away as you claim.

        FWIW, I’m sure you remember decades ago, when people would joke about using WaPo and many other papers to wrap fish and paper the bird cage. What they do is not new but at the same time, they do excellent reporting – reporting that you guys read and even cite as factual sometimes.!

        You condemn them , rightly so, for their shortfalls, but you don’t give credit for when they do good nor see the balance between the two.

        It’s an untenable position if you continue to read them IMO.

        If you really do condemn them, then walk away and don’t read them anymore.

        1. Randy Huffman Avatar
          Randy Huffman

          You raise an interesting question, why read media you totally disagree with?

          As a general rule, I don’t. But I want to read multiple sources as cross checks and to be sure I am not reading or listening to media that simply echo’s my current thinking. How can we evolve, check ourselves, and make good arguments if all you read is what you believe in. You obviously follow that thinking as you disagree with a significant number of postings yet you still read and comment.

          I will say that I was reading the local Charlottesville paper and commenting from time to time for several months after they hired a new very “Left” opinion editor who I have nothing in common. But he has gotten so extreme, and the paper has no balance, that I decided to “take a break” from reading the Daily Progress for a couple months. My beef is not just his Editorials, its their inability to publish just about any differing view point other than a very infrequent op-ed, and Letters to the Editor, and I have expressed that view to them.

          I did re-instate my Sunday hard copy last weekend, and was pretty disgusted with their continued one side reporting, so not sure I will go back again other than it is the local paper….. Right now I get local news from reading the web sites form the two local TV stations and radio.

          1. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            I read with a skeptical eye anything where there is disagreement and try to understand the divergent positions.

            I don’t consider ANY news media left or right trustworthy on partisan issues.

            At the same time, WaPo , NYT and others do report, apparently well on some things because even their critics cite the article, even right here in BR , when it suits their narrative.

            And if the “alternative” to the MSM is FOX news, the Washington Examiner, WSJ “opinion” vice “news”, Brietbart and the plethora of other Conservative “news” platforms, I seriously doubt it.

            When we say stuff like Solar Farms don’t have to meet environmental laws like is said in BR, it’s just not the truth, it’s gaslighting.

          2. Randy Huffman Avatar
            Randy Huffman

            For me, I get my conservative news from the Washington Time’s and Examiner, WSJ (Opinion is conservatives, but the paper itself very balanced and I read it all), New York Post, and Yes, FOX News. Fox does in fact present some differing view points, much more than anyone in the Left is willing to concede, though I will not suggest they “center news”. So I proudly read those, along with several others to get differing views from both sides, I stay away from some of the more far right news as much as the far left. I have Left oriented family members who read nothing but the NYT and similar NY media, and they refuse to touch anything conservative oriented, so in my opinion have no clue with anything that is going on in the real world.

          3. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            For all the liberal media is guilty of with respect to bias they can’t hold a candle to the “differing views” that are outright lies at times – like the lies about the Dominion voting systems that enabled Trump and company to further spread conspiracy theories.

            It’s fine to hold conservative viewpoints -even needed – but lies and conspiracy theories runs rampant in conservative media IMO.

          4. Randy Huffman Avatar
            Randy Huffman

            You do know that many in conservative media (including a number from Fox News!) questioned that, don’t you? Many reported that Trump and others were making the claim, but never endorsed it. This is pure misinformation that runs rampant in Left wing media!

          5. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            I KNOW that FOX did not admit the error on air AND they are in court about it.

            That’s a fact not misinformation.

            They have supported and promoted quite a number of false things in support of Trump. They have him on and he lies and they do not question it or point it out. It’s a platform for Trump.

            They have other folks on who outright lie and engage in conspiracy theories. FOX gives them a platform and again, does not question the lies and misinformation those guests spout,

            Many of these folks are now in court over their lies..

            How many of those on CNN are in court over their lies?

          6. Randy Huffman Avatar
            Randy Huffman

            Hmm, Nick Sandmann?

            How about Trumps lawsuit two days, ago? Here is an opinion piece that the lawsuit has no hope, from the Washington Examiner!
            https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/restoring-america/fairness-justice/trumps-cnn-lawsuit-nothing-to-do-with-law

            Just because Dominion sued Fox doesn’t mean it stands any more of a chance to win than Trump’s suit. For his part, I do not believe Tucker argued Dominion’s falsified results, I believe he said he doesn’t trust electronic voting systems, and had a number of other issues on how the 2020 election was held (like censorship from social media which was absolutely taking place and has been swept under the rug, and potential issues with certain states handling of mail in ballots and drop boxes, which is very difficult to catch fraud after the fact).

            I’m leaving it there and let you have the last word if you want. Randy

          7. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            Dominion would not be suing if FOX admitted the error – not commentary from individuals but a statement from FOX itself.

            This is the game being played.

            Fraud is a reality but the question is – was the election “stolen” by a widespread coordinated fraud for one candidate that extended across thousands of precincts and states?

            Did that happen?

            Or are you really complaining that it’s too EASY to vote and the EASY votes went against Trump and therefore we need to restrict such votes?

            The real point is that Trump gets up along with others and makes outlandish and totally untrue allegations that the courts have summarily rejected as false and apparently FOX chooses to not report that what Trump and allies are saying are not true and basically lies.

            When they do that, they promote and encourage these conspiracy theory folks to run amok – to the point where some are now threatening election officials.

            You can’t have a democracy if election officials quit over threats.

            That’s how dictatorships work.

          8. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            There’s a BIG difference between Opinion and News and in my mind they get pretty confused on conservative media.

            We have folks who “cite” WSJ as if it is factual when, in fact, it’s opinion.

            FOX “News” is not “News” 24/7 and especially so in the evening with folks like Hannity, Carlson and others spewing things other than facts and riling up their audience that believes them.

            It would be a hard thing to list out ONLY the actual “news” folks for FOX who don’t do what Hannity and Carlson do.

            They’ve booted a bunch of folks who only did hard news and folks like Chris Wallace who insisted on facts.

          9. Randy Huffman Avatar
            Randy Huffman

            Chris Wallace left on his own terms, I did watch him a fair amount, but he tilted Left and made his views well known. Even so I was sorry to see him go. Shannon Bream who has just taken his place is outstanding. She is conservative, but very balanced in allowing everyone to air their views, and will do fair interviews with both sides of the aisle.

            I do watch Tucker a couple times a week, and while I don’t agree with him on a number of things (eg his view on the Russia/Ukraine war), he delves into matters most anchors are too biased or chicken to cover. You need to actually watch the show, not rely on snipits from CNN or MSNBC!

          10. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            I don’t see where Wallace “tilted” left at all. That’s what FOX claimed when they booted him. He’s not the only one.

            Tucker is not “news” at all. He’s pure provocateur and plays fast and loose with the facts IMO.

            I watch the show and I know what they do.

            I don’t watch MSN at all – they are as far left as FOX is far right.

            I do watch CNN and they have a wide variety of GOP/Republicans/Conservatives on every day and they are given plenty of time to state their positions and do.

            Rick Scott and Rubio were both on Sunday.

            https://thehill.com/homenews/media/3634717-changes-spark-chatter-of-cnn-is-shift-from-left-to-right/

          11. Randy Huffman Avatar
            Randy Huffman

            Wallace tilted Left, you just didn’t see it (but I still watched and respected Chris). CNN has changed, so the take away here is I will try and watch it a few times and see for, myself. Give me an anchor name who you think is fair and I will DVR it and watch the show a couple times. You should check out Fox news Sunday with Shannon.

          12. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            Wallace was forced out because FOX wanted him to toe their line.

            When you say “tilted left”, how about some examples?

            Of all the Sunday shows, he was the most Conservative by far.

            Anchors are “readers”, right? They don’t do opinion.

            That’s the distinction between “news” and “opinion”.

            None of FOX nor CNNs nighttime is “news” per se but mostly opinion and commentary.

            But even opinion and commentary SHOULD be based on facts and SHOULD not be based on known lies and falsehoods.

            I have watched Bream before and was not particularly impressed. but I will give it a shot and report back.

            What I seriously object to is ANYONE coming on ANY network and spouting lies and the network just allows it without comment.

            We have people running around this country threatening election workers and believing in conspiracy theories because of network “reporting” that was allowed to be presented without rebuttal and factual reporting.

            There is no election conspiracy – it’s a falsehood that virtually all courts have dismissed as frivolous and yet it persists because it is aided by some media.

          13. James McCarthy Avatar
            James McCarthy

            Seems to me if your opinions are well formed, there’s little need to read media news from opposing ends of the spectrum either to confirm or challenge the well formed opinions. Surely such opposing media are unlikely to infect or seriously disturb them. It’s simple to avoid opinion writers with whom one disagrees or to read them out of curiosity. It is, admittedly, difficult to discern journalism from mere reporting. BR is a fine platform to practice.

    2. DJRippert Avatar
      DJRippert

      Back in 1975 he woke concept of cancellation had not yet been invented. Shockley was a Nobel Prize winner, for God’s sake. His abhorrent ideas needed to be refuted, not ignored.

      As for the idea that the debate only lent credibility to Shockley’s ideas … I guess you think that, 47 years later, it’s OK to second-guess Goldsby – who obviously thought that debating Shockley was a good and just idea. I’m sure that Professor Goldsby regrets that there wasn’t a White savior such as yourself back in 1975 to point out the stupidity of his willingness to debate Shockley.

      As it turns out, the idea that Blacks are genetically intellectually inferior to Whites didn’t die out in the 1970s with Shockley. In a 1993 review of Daniel Seligman’s book A Question of Intelligence Goldsby wrote that “I find this book pernicious because its clear purpose is to infect readers with the view that both the established schools of behavioural psychology and human genetics consider it scientifically demonstrated that group differences in black-white IQs are largely genetic in origin. Such a demonstration has not been made and Seligman probably understands that it has not.”

      In 1994 Charles Murray wrote, “The Bell Curve” – another tome trying to point out the supposed intellectual inferiority of Blacks vs Whites. I’d guess that Professor Goldsby took on Murray as well.

    3. DJRippert Avatar
      DJRippert

      Back in 1975 he woke concept of cancellation had not yet been invented. Shockley was a Nobel Prize winner, for God’s sake. His abhorrent ideas needed to be refuted, not ignored.

      As for the idea that the debate only lent credibility to Shockley’s ideas … I guess you think that, 47 years later, it’s OK to second-guess Goldsby – who obviously thought that debating Shockley was a good and just idea. I’m sure that Professor Goldsby regrets that there wasn’t a White savior such as yourself back in 1975 to point out the stupidity of his willingness to debate Shockley.

      As it turns out, the idea that Blacks are genetically intellectually inferior to Whites didn’t die out in the 1970s with Shockley. In a 1993 review of Daniel Seligman’s book A Question of Intelligence Goldsby wrote that “I find this book pernicious because its clear purpose is to infect readers with the view that both the established schools of behavioural psychology and human genetics consider it scientifically demonstrated that group differences in black-white IQs are largely genetic in origin. Such a demonstration has not been made and Seligman probably understands that it has not.”

      In 1994 Charles Murray wrote, “The Bell Curve” – another tome trying to point out the supposed intellectual inferiority of Blacks vs Whites. I’d guess that Professor Goldsby took on Murray as well.

    4. DJRippert Avatar
      DJRippert

      Back in 1975 he woke concept of cancellation had not yet been invented. Shockley was a Nobel Prize winner, for God’s sake. His abhorrent ideas needed to be refuted, not ignored.

      As for the idea that the debate only lent credibility to Shockley’s ideas … I guess you think that, 47 years later, it’s OK to second-guess Goldsby – who obviously thought that debating Shockley was a good and just idea. I’m sure that Professor Goldsby regrets that there wasn’t a White savior such as yourself back in 1975 to point out the stupidity of his willingness to debate Shockley.

      As it turns out, the idea that Blacks are genetically intellectually inferior to Whites didn’t die out in the 1970s with Shockley. In a 1993 review of Daniel Seligman’s book A Question of Intelligence Goldsby wrote that “I find this book pernicious because its clear purpose is to infect readers with the view that both the established schools of behavioural psychology and human genetics consider it scientifically demonstrated that group differences in black-white IQs are largely genetic in origin. Such a demonstration has not been made and Seligman probably understands that it has not.”

      In 1994 Charles Murray wrote, “The Bell Curve” – another tome trying to point out the supposed intellectual inferiority of Blacks vs Whites. I’d guess that Professor Goldsby took on Murray as well.

      1. LarrytheG Avatar
        LarrytheG

        re: ” As it turns out, the idea that Blacks are genetically intellectually inferior to Whites didn’t die out in the 1970s with Shockley. ”

        the “idea” is repugnant and racist – period – full stop.

        those who engage in it are showing their own “ideas”.

        You seem to think that is a guy/gal has other significant achievements that they’re allowed to be racists if they want.

        no?

        Sounds about right.

  4. Nancy Naive Avatar
    Nancy Naive

    Curious minds want to know…

    Is it true that Virginia just paid $268T to place ads featuring Glenn Youngkin in airports throughout the country?

    Or, are they only running at airports in States where Youngkin is stumping?

    1. DJRippert Avatar
      DJRippert

      $268 trillion dollars? That sounds more like a Biden spending bill than an advertising campaign.

      1. James McCarthy Avatar
        James McCarthy

        Gosh! Exaggeration can be so confusing. Media today reports US debt is $31 Trillion. Who to believe.

      2. Nancy Naive Avatar
        Nancy Naive

        Thousand. Context DJ, context. $268K

        1. James McCarthy Avatar
          James McCarthy

          Ya know, this entire article concerns accurate and complete reporting or better journalism to avoid misunderstanding and/or bias. T to some was T. Rex. Initially, I thought it represented Tons. Given Youngthing’s campaign travels it could have been Tongues.

    2. DJRippert Avatar
      DJRippert

      $268 trillion dollars? That sounds more like a Biden spending bill than an advertising campaign.

  5. Eric the half a troll Avatar
    Eric the half a troll

    Another story about that guy that travelled hundreds of miles to “debate” a female student on campus and only left her alone when confronted by security…?

  6. Eric the half a troll Avatar
    Eric the half a troll

    Another story about that guy that travelled hundreds of miles to “debate” a female student on campus and only left her alone when confronted by security…?

  7. Nancy Naive Avatar
    Nancy Naive

    “Shockley’s views about Black intellectual inferiority have been broadly rejected by American society in the 47 years …”

    Have they? Have they really?

    https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2013/05/jason-richwine-hispanics-and-iqs-the-heritage-foundation-scholar-began-researching-race-and-intelligence-at-harvard.html

    Heritage Foundation? Hey! Ain’t they mostly white and big time Conservative?

    https://www.pewresearch.org/social-trends/psdt_03-25-19_race_update-18/

    https://www.journals.uchicago.edu/doi/pdf/10.1086/204468

    1. LarrytheG Avatar
      LarrytheG

      Oh, racism never dies. Nor do the folks that like to straddle that line.

      1. Nancy Naive Avatar
        Nancy Naive

        Nobody ’round dese parts tho, eh? Nah…
        High-IQ non-white? Anomaly.

        1. LarrytheG Avatar
          LarrytheG

          …. edit…. Anomaly ?

          could it be? can we debate it?

    2. Eric the half a troll Avatar
      Eric the half a troll

      It’s “culture” not “race”… 😉

      1. LarrytheG Avatar
        LarrytheG

        eh…. let’s debate “cultures” ?

        Those Asians are just culturally superior?

        1. Nancy Naive Avatar
          Nancy Naive

          No. No. Not superior. Just older… besides they didn’t give us anything but noodles.

      2. Nancy Naive Avatar
        Nancy Naive

        “But there was one spoiler — a cringingly awkward placard about cultural appropriation. Man Ray, you see, had committed the cardinal sin of appreciating African art and incorporating it into some of his photographs. That, lecture the exhibit’s curators, amounted to “a blatant act of cultural appropriating …”
        https://www.baconsrebellion.com/the-cultural-bankruptcy-of-cultural-appropriation/

        But when Black folks and liberals want to remove a Confederate statue… Well, now…

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