Pilot Editorial Shows Glimmers of Insight

A glimmer of light… but just a glimmer

by James A. Bacon

The editorial board of The Virginian-Pilot and Daily Press is committed to the proposition that the United States is afflicted by “systemic inequalities” between the races. The publication’s analysis is more nuanced, however, than much of what we read and hear. Opining on the role of credit scores in building wealth in America, the Pilot wrote in a column yesterday, “Race plays a role, but is not in itself the determining factor.”

It’s refreshing to see the Pilot’s pundits not using racism as the universal explanation for all social ills besetting minorities today. But they still have a bit to learn.

African Americans have lower credit scores on average than the general population, the Pilot notes, drawing from research conducted by The Washington Post. The reason isn’t overt racism or even bias in the credit-reporting systems, it appears, but the fact that credit scores are lower in Southern states… and the African-American population is concentrated in the South. Why are credit scores lower in the South? Because of medical debt. Says the Pilot: “The South has a lot more unpaid medical bills than other regions.”

Unpaid medical bills may not sound like institutional racism, but the Pilot’s pontificators imply that it really is.

For starters the South has more than our share of unhealthy people. Much of that poor health is a result of systemic inequalities that lead to poverty and related problems such as food “deserts” where inner-city people have limited access to healthy foods.

Plus, the South was slower to expand Medicaid than other regions of the country.

Thus, in the worldview of the Pilot’s editorial writers, the chain of causality runs like this: (1) Racism created food deserts; (2) which made people overweight; (3) which put more people in the hospital; (4) which resulted in bigger medical bills; which people could not always repay until Medicaid came along; (5) which hurt credit scores; (6) which contributed to a wealth gap.

As Rube Goldberg-esque as this logic chain is, it represents intellectual progress of sorts because the editorial writers do not attribute inequality to vague, amorphous concepts such as “racism” or “bias.” They are at least trying to identify the mechanisms by which “systematic inequality “arises.

However, it escapes the notice of the Pilot’s pontificators that the challenges afflicting poor African Americans are pretty much the same as the challenges afflicting poor Whites — or the poor of any ethnicity. People born into poor families inherit no financial resources from their parents. They start out life accumulating debt. They have higher rates of obesity, diabetes and heart disease. They incur medical debts they have trouble paying off. And they have lower credit scores as a result.

That schema leaves out a lot, as I’ll get to in a moment. The point worth stressing is that low credit scores are a symptom of poverty, not of “systemic racism,” “systemic inequality,” or whatever other phrase the Pilot chooses to use.

But causality is even more complex than the Pilot lets on.

Poverty is hardly unique to African Americans. How do we explain the persistence of poverty among large numbers of White people, who never experienced racism and segregation?

How do we explain the fact that Hispanics, a disadvantaged group, have higher life expectancies than Whites, a supposedly privileged group? Do Hispanics have less bad medical debt? Do they have better credit scores?

How does the Pilot explain the ability of waves of immigrants, from Cubans to Vietnamese boat people, who arrive penniless in the U.S., face similar challenges as poor Whites and Blacks, and lift themselves out of poverty?

The Pilot pundits cannot yet bring themselves to admit that an individual’s behavior affects his social mobility. Americans (and immigrants) who hew to the old-fashioned values — emphasizing strong, two-parent families; stressing educational achievement; insisting that young people complete their education, get jobs, and get married before having children; teaching impulse control, anger management, and respect for the law; prioritizing savings over consumption; and eschewing debt — tend to be more successful than people who don’t.

It is true that poverty constrains the options available to individuals born into that condition. Their struggle is harder. But it is also true that millions of Americans still manage to overcome economic disadvantage and climb into the middle class.

The problem with tying all inequality to racism is that it deprives people of agency. The poor — especially poor minorities — are taught that the system is stacked against them, that their efforts at self-improvement are pointless, that only political activism can change their lives for the better. Indeed, it is common today to denounce the old-fashioned virtues as attributes of “whiteness” and the product of “white supremacy,” which minority students should spurn.

Values matter. Personal virtue matters. That’s not to say that values and virtues are the only things that matter, but any critique of society that ignores them is doomed to failure. The Pilot editorial writers deserve credit for rejecting strict racial determinism. But their understanding of social dynamics still has a long way to go.


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94 responses to “Pilot Editorial Shows Glimmers of Insight”

  1. M. Purdy Avatar

    “The problem with tying all inequality to racism is that it deprives people of agency.” Who is tying all inequality to racism?

    1. Nancy Naive Avatar
      Nancy Naive

      Racists?

      1. Lefty665 Avatar

        and Woke Racists.

    2. Donald Smith Avatar
      Donald Smith

      The vast majority of Virginia and national media, for starters.

      Before you demand specifics, let me remind you of something I learned as a defense contractor: perception is reality.

      It is a widely-held perception that progressives are prone to race-baiting, and inclined to think of the world in a collection of oppressor and oppressed groups. We all know that progressives dominate the MSM, nationally and in the state. Hence the perception that one of the default causes the MSM reaches for for (insert name of whatever problem comes to mind here) is racism.

      As I’ve explained, you don’t get to dictate how you are perceived. People connect the dots for themselves and come to their own conclusion. If you are unhappy with our conclusions, that’s fine.

      1. M. Purdy Avatar

        It’s a strawman.

      2. James McCarthy Avatar
        James McCarthy

        Your perception is reality but not necessarily universally accepted. As this article argues, the universal reality you accept is undergoing change. Since Fox is the #1 watched MSM, it cannot be asserted that all media communicate with a single perception. “We” don’t all know what you assert that contradicts “our” conclusions. You are perceived upon your expressions in writing as to the manner you connect the dots. Try looking outside the box.

    3. Monica Wright Avatar
      Monica Wright

      The entire concept of intersectionality, rejected by most here, is based on the notion that individuals have advantages and disadvantages that are both (un)earned and innate, associated with their various interests, associations, statuses, and qualities and that the combination of factors is unique to each person.

      1. James McCarthy Avatar
        James McCarthy

        There’s a great depth to what can or may be shared in society that is not unique to each person. Racism, poverty, hunger are not unique. They tend to plague social cohorts and cannot be said to be earned or necessarily unearned or even innate. Once upon a time, society generally accepted that humans could be chattel. Freedom from racism, poverty, hunger requires a collective agreement often involving the sharing of the common wealth.

        1. Monica Wright Avatar
          Monica Wright

          It’s not specific statuses that are unique but the ways in which they impact, are experienced by, and are magnified or compensated for within each individual that are unique. It’s also not a fixed assessment of privilege or oppression but changes over time based on what you do/experience in your life. You’d be hard-pressed to find black and white boomers who experienced their coming of age years in exactly the same way even if their parents had exactly the same incomes and professions (difference). My grandmother once said that she had more in common with the elderly people in the retirement home than youth tho, in part because of their shared historical references, even as they were once her tormentors (similarity). Wrestling with that level of nuance is harder for some than others.

          The so-called ‘rube goldberg-esque’ logic described in the post is, in fact, exactly the connection those talking about CRT and systemic racism make. The data supports them. I’m not sure upon what data counter arguments rest.

          1. M. Purdy Avatar

            No data at all, but lots of gut feelings by the narrow demo this site caters to.

      2. Nancy Naive Avatar
        Nancy Naive

        And shared. It’s the shared advantage that’s at issue.

  2. Kathleen Smith Avatar
    Kathleen Smith

    Great discussion. Well thought out.

  3. Nancy Naive Avatar
    Nancy Naive

    So, “race plays a role but is not in itself the determining factor,” eh?

    Not “the” just an another “a”.

    And that makes it something less than racism?

  4. Nancy Naive Avatar
    Nancy Naive

    So, “race plays a role but is not in itself the determining factor,” eh?

    Not “the” just an another “a”.

    And that makes it something less than racism?

    1. walter smith Avatar
      walter smith

      Yes. Some people overcome”racism.” Some choose to be victims of “racism.” Some choose to profit off of “racism.” Some choose to virtue signal over “racism.”

      1. James McCarthy Avatar
        James McCarthy

        And some choose to deflect the reality of racism and wag a finger of tut-tut toward others who also distort its effects.

        1. Donald Smith Avatar
          Donald Smith

          And some choose to use the reality of racism—which has existed since the beginning of time—as a crutch and an excuse.

          1. James McCarthy Avatar
            James McCarthy

            How many? Why? Slavery has never been moral only accepted, promoted, and encouraged. If some, in fact, use it as a crutch and an excuse, it only means the task of its elimination is more difficult. It means racists have been extraordinarily successful.

          2. Can you cite the source for the moral pronouncement that “Slavery has never been moral”?

          3. James McCarthy Avatar
            James McCarthy

            In 1814, Thomas Jefferson declared slavery was a moral depravity. Start there to ID the historical antecedents. Although accepted legally by religious groups for centuries, slavery was also often criticized as unethical and un-Christian. Legal acknowledgement is not synonymous with morality.

          4. Sorry, but I don’t see how that applies to your statement. ‘Never been moral’ didn’t start in 1814. What is the source, the philosophical basis if you wish to say it that way, of the pronouncement?

          5. Nancy Naive Avatar
            Nancy Naive

            Gotcha. Immoral?

            Oh, it’s been “moral” since time immemorial. Morals are, after all, nothing more than carrots and sticks from an imaginary creature.

            Now, unethical? That it has always been.

          6. The question still applies. What is the source for the pronouncement ‘slavery has always been unethical’ (never been ethical)?
            You say,
            Morals are, after all, nothing more than carrots and sticks from an imaginary creature.

            If you can’t supply a rational argument in support of your claim, then it is from a source no less imaginary.

          7. James McCarthy Avatar
            James McCarthy

            You are confusing morals with morels. Moral values do not rely upon an external source as they are effective when accepted by individuals and groups. By and large, the morals of the Ten Commandments are no less imaginary than questions about their existence. If slavery was ever moral, please provide your rationale, if you wish to argue that. No source will be demanded to support that projection.

          8. I am not and never have argued that slavery was moral.

          9. James McCarthy Avatar
            James McCarthy

            Then, if you believe it is immoral, you have identified that authoritative source.

          10. James McCarthy Avatar
            James McCarthy

            If no source or authority exists to anchor a conclusion that slavery has “never been moral”(or ethical) what difference does that make to the discussion? If the sources cited (Aquinas, Bonaventure, Jefferson, King George) are insufficient, challenge them. Offer material advocating the moral basis for slavery.

          11. If no source or authority exists, then it is not a rational statement, but an emotional one, and, as such, has no moral value.

          12. M. Purdy Avatar

            “We hold these truths to be self-evident….” So I guess our country is irrational and has no moral value?

          13. Had I been there, and if they offered it as moral guidance instead of a political statement, I would have asked for clarity, just as I have done here to those offering their arguments as moral guidance. I think I would have gotten a thoughtful response from them. Unfortunately, they aren’t here to provide an insightful response.

            While it’s not in the document, the committees of correspondence and media of that period discussed the topic publicly for a long time before the Br attacked Lexington and Concord. It wasn’t that they didn’t discuss it, it was that they didn’t write it down in the Declaration.

          14. M. Purdy Avatar

            There is a reason (i.e., reason) why Jefferson didn’t cite to the Bible, Magna Carta or any other doc. Think about it.

          15. James McCarthy Avatar
            James McCarthy

            Thus, like abortion, it doesn’t exist. Not then, not now not tomorrow. The Amendment declaring slavery “shall not exist” itself is lacking moral precedent and authority. Worse, the amendment lacks an authoritative source.

          16. The constitution is a legal document, not a moral tract. Do you know and respect the difference? Are you arguing that what is legal is always moral? I hope not. That’s back to might makes right and the Tyranny of the Majority.

          17. James McCarthy Avatar
            James McCarthy

            Moral values may be questionable but exist indifferent to emotions or rationality.

          18. Why did I ask the question? Because I don’t know what you mean by slavery until you define it. Do you mean only physical enslavement, or is there also economic enslavement, etc? Are there degrees of enslavement? Broad statements like ‘slavery is wrong’ are easy for everyone to agree with, but as adults, we should have learned that the devil is in the details.
            At some point, ‘slavery is wrong’ will intersect with some other broad but ill defined statement like ‘their fair share’. I asked a few weeks ago in another thread on BR if anyone could define what a fair share was – silence ensued.
            How do we reconcile those 2 concepts into public policy when they are so ill defined? Without definitions of both concepts, How can we be sure that those setting the fair share aren’t overstepping the bounds into economic slavery?

            This is only the tip of the iceberg. Can we talk about the obligation to help the needy without also talking about the obligation of the needy to help themselves and not become dependent on others to support them? How does public policy enforce both those obligations?

            Many other examples exist, but are also not discussed.

            I view morality as the rules of conduct between 2 or more sentient beings. It is not a one way exchange, where one side makes demands that the other side has to meet to be considered moral. It is a partnership where both sides have duties and obligations that must be reasonable. Defining the terms is a requirement.

          19. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            Do you understand the meaning of slavery as articulated in the 13th amendment?

            Or is it not explicit?

          20. James McCarthy Avatar
            James McCarthy

            Well now, you seem to have answered your own conundrum. The discussion of slavery concerned its contemporary character in our society but not the “slavery” that may have been accepted in more ancient times as labor in exchange for a debt. The contemporary character of slavery includes chattel or ownership of humans. That is the intersection that prompted religions – like the Quakers – to condemn slavery.

            If charity is a moral value , society can determine what share of common wealth is to be extended to less fortunate. The extent of charity may always be in question including whether it ought to be conditioned upon a behavioral change by recipients.

            My statement was “slavery has never been moral.” Not right or wrong – simply not moral. Morals do not make demands only establish expectations of conduct. Like laws which don’t by themselves prevent crime or guarantee seat belt use, morals are behavioral precepts.

          21. There are several errors in your reply.
            1- I don’t have a conundrum. I know what I mean. My question is what do YOU mean?
            2- Since I can’t read your mind, I can’t possibly have answered the question about what you mean.
            3- Telling me what the Quakers think about slavery doesn’t tell me what you think.
            4- Charity is a moral value. To be moral it must be given freely without coercion. Demanding it by force of law removes any moral value. Calling forced giving charity is wrong. Unless you are willing to discuss and set limits on fair share and determine the obligations of those who receive public assistance, you are advocating the Tyranny of the Majority (mob rule) (whatever the traffic will bear). That’s the same argument used to justify slavery (people voted for it).

          22. James McCarthy Avatar
            James McCarthy

            1. I mean chattel slavery was never moral;
            2. What do you mean morals are imaginary?
            3. I think chattel slavery has never been moral;
            4. No allegation was made about “forced” charity; however, govts May share the common wealth of forced giving (taxes) to assist less fortunate members of society, e.g. FEMA.
            Some charity such as required emergency room treatment, school lunches, etc are unconditional without majority tyranny. As a society value it may be deemed amoral while satisfying a moral purpose. One of the themes of the JAB article is that such concepts do not fit neatly into definitional categories. Every member we of society benefits directly or indirectly from sharing the common wealth not all of which is “public assistance.”

          23. 1- why do you think it was never moral? That’s my question.

            2- I never said morals are imaginary.

            3- Forced chastity? For the record, I am opposed to forced chastity. It’s not the act of giving that has moral value. Charity is the free choice to give. What makes you a good person is that you didn’t have to be coerced.

          24. James McCarthy Avatar
            James McCarthy

            If you are in possession of info that declares slavery as moral, please share. The ethical and moral foundation of slavery was questioned by Thomas Aquinas and St. Bonaventure centuries ago.

          25. I never said or implied that it was moral; that is your projection. I asked what is the basis of your absolute statement.
            Besides, you made the statement, not me. Are you saying you cannot support your claim with a rational argument?

          26. James McCarthy Avatar
            James McCarthy

            Common sense; Aquinas; Bonaventure; King George; Jefferson; Catholic Spanish royalty. Contrary historical sources affirming the morality of slavery are welcome.

          27. Eric the half a troll Avatar
            Eric the half a troll

            I think we can take the well documented history of human beings sacrificing themselves in battle in order to prevent their loved ones from being enslaved as a pretty strong indicator.

          28. Nancy Naive Avatar
            Nancy Naive

            King George III wrote a treatise on the immorality of slavery in the 1760s.

            One might assume that the King’s abhorrence of the slave trade could have been an impetus to revolution.

          29. Lefty665 Avatar

            We learned from the 1619 Project that was the reason we revolted. Therefore the revolting colonists must have thought slavery was moral, although contributing to poor morale.

          30. Nancy Naive Avatar
            Nancy Naive

            Not entirely out of the realm of possibility. After all, when the States that hadn’t abolished slavery by 1861 became convinced that the other States were going to act against them, they revolted. No reason to believe they didn’t do it before 1861.

            If you catch an employee stealing from the till, do you really believe it was the first time?

          31. Matt Adams Avatar
            Matt Adams

            Yes Sir, that benevolent Lord Dunmore as behest of King George freed all those slaves to fight for the Crown.

            I suppose that decree only applied to Colonials Slaves though, much like the Emancipation Proclamation only applied to the South, because he invited all his loyalist pals to join him in the Bahama’s where they had slavery till 1834.

          32. M. Purdy Avatar

            Do you really need a citation to say ‘slavery has never been moral’? Or are you saying historically, some societies had no qualms with the institution. That’s different, of course.

          33. Yes, to both questions.
            The second because it’s historical fact.
            The first because judgemental statements should have a basis. You made the statement, but don’t seem willing to explain the basis.

          34. M. Purdy Avatar

            I didn’t make the statement for clarity, but I don’t think that making a moral judgment on something like slavery is all that hard. I also don’t think child labor is moral, human sacrifice is moral, or sexual mutilation is moral, even though some cultures accept such practices. You shouldn’t need a poster or a source to tell you such.

          35. Matt Adams Avatar
            Matt Adams

            The quandary is that morality is based upon the time in which the event occurred. Which is why the current trend of “presentism” is so dangerous.

          36. Eric the half a troll Avatar
            Eric the half a troll

            Ahh, the old “just learn to deal with racism” argument… haven’t heard that one in a while…

          37. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            The Constitution and our Govt specifically rejects the idea that racism is acceptable in America, no matter what other countries do or have done in the past.

            We reject it in words but we still have trouble carrying out the deed.

        2. walter smith Avatar
          walter smith

          Then how do you explain the people who succeed? Why didn’t the systemic racism keep them down? Behavior matters. Bad choices lead to bad ends…usually. A prolonged period of good choices leads to good outcomes…usually. Seriously, you people of the Leftist persuasion are racist – you think blacks incapable of making good decisions and powerless to avoid bad ones? You are poison.

          1. James McCarthy Avatar
            James McCarthy

            As stated, systemic racism is a component, a factor in barriers to some in succeeding. This article confirms that while also advocating for recognition of other factors such as poverty, health. You people of the Right prefer to ascribe failure wholly to individual shortcomings. Might you acknowledge that, had racism never existed or been institutionalized as laws, more would have succeeded?

          2. walter smith Avatar
            walter smith

            And might you acknowledge “systemic” has been illegal for decades? Or that we have now instituted reverse institutional racism? And that it is harmful? That maybe equal under the law is the best approach? And will you acknowledge that behavior matters? Rich people have advantages. Tall men have advantages. Better athletes have advantages. Smart people have advantages. Better looking people have advantages. Children in two parent families in general have advantages over children not in two parent families. Children of smart parents are more likely to have higher IQs. Why not outlaw assortative mating and require pairing IQ sums of the man and woman to be within an “equitable” range?

          3. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            Walter, how do you explain why everyone did not become millionaires? bad behaviors?

          4. walter smith Avatar
            walter smith

            Was it racism that stopped you from becoming a millionaire?

          5. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            Black folks, yes.

            https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/51dea1021b5a6607db44471d6a981251db687a1fb0be5ff5e4cda3e476ae3184.jpg

            https://www.stlouisfed.org/on-the-economy/2021/january/wealth-gaps-white-black-hispanic-families-2019#:~:text=Percentages%20of%20households%20who%20are,Hispanic%20families%E2%80%943%25

            To your point, yes, SOME small number of blacks were able to overcome racism to succeed, but the vast majority have not – the same as only a small number of people are unique enough to become millionaires while the vast majority do not.

      2. VaNavVet Avatar

        Well said Walt and for once I can’t disagree.

    2. VaNavVet Avatar

      Bigotry!

  5. James McCarthy Avatar
    James McCarthy

    JAB, like the newspaper, deserves credit for rejecting the strict agency remedy, Darwinian remedy for poverty and acknowledging that residual racism persists. In this regard, the difference between left and right is one more of degree and currency of the effects of racism and poverty. While “millions of Americans still manage to overcome economic disadvantage and climb into the middle class,” that observation requires the contextual considerations of when and how that climb occurs across a dense population. Who manages to overcome, striving for how long, to what status. P.S. Glimmer of insight.

  6. LarrytheG Avatar
    LarrytheG

    re: ” Plus, the South was slower to expand Medicaid than other regions of the country.”

    as in not expanded and people not wealthy, not having insurance.

    JAB seems to want to imply that unhealthy lifestyles are somehow connected to race, ergo, “it’s their fault”.

    re: ” But it is also true that millions of Americans still manage to overcome economic disadvantage and climb into the middle class.”

    It’s true, SOME people DO overcome and succeed. The vast majority do not and people whose families already do have wealth have better opportunity to do that.

  7. LarrytheG Avatar
    LarrytheG

    re: ” The Pilot pundits cannot yet bring themselves to admit that an individual’s behavior affects his social mobility. Americans (and immigrants) who hew to the old-fashioned values — emphasizing strong, two-parent families; stressing educational achievement; insisting that young people complete their education, get jobs, and get married before having children; teaching impulse control, anger management, and respect for the law; prioritizing savings over consumption; and eschewing debt — tend to be more successful than people who don’t.”

    Is this comment about race? Is it saying that minorities
    have these problems more than others?

    I ask this because up above this it says this:

    ” It’s refreshing to see the Pilot’s pundits not using racism as the universal explanation for all social ills besetting minorities today. But they still have a bit to learn.”

    So JAB is, once again, making race an issue all the while we hear that “progressives” make everything about race and MLK talked about content of character and not color.

    It seems like in BR, we come back again and again and again to race .

    To be clear and honest – this is more about poverty of which minorities have a larger percentage because of longstanding racist policies that have been used against them for decades and the impact of it continue for generations even as we STILL have some vestiges of structural racism.

    And some of us CONTINUE to blame the people who have been harmed by racism for their plight.

    You don’t have to go far back in Virginia history before you know that black folks were denied a public education. Some who write here in BR were alive at the time of Massive Resistance – they were aware of it.

    And somehow , some think that even if granddad and grandmom were denied an education that their children got very good educations then they had kids that failed to get good educations… and that’s the problem.

    The damage from Massive Resistance and Jim Crow is generational… that’s the simple truth – but recognizing that truth is believed to be making excuses for poor behaviors as if folks in poverty – regardless of color – shouldn’t be making poor decisions… and it’s their fault
    for doing so. It’s called ignorance and it comes from a lack of a good education and being poor – not by choice.

  8. Eric the half a troll Avatar
    Eric the half a troll

    “It’s refreshing to see the Pilot’s pundits not using racism as the universal explanation for all social ills besetting minorities today.”

    That is your construct… not mine or anyone I know…

    1. LarrytheG Avatar
      LarrytheG

      It’s a durable strawman, though.

  9. Jonathan DeWilicker Avatar
    Jonathan DeWilicker

    “systemic racism” is just the latest phantom explanation for the disparity between outcome between various groups. You see, the race hustlers have run out of excuses after 60+ years of enormous expenditures (both societal and financial) in the form of affirmative action, public housing, WIC, and thousands of other social initiatives. There’s been free housing, free schooling, free meals, free clothing, free everything. AAs get a leg up in admissions to every university in the country, have myriad of scholarships and grants available to them. Companies bend over backward to hire and retain them. Every city/community has support groups that ONLY support AAs. Hell, Charlottesville has a special website and is on the downtown mall daily with pamphlets trying to promote black owned businesses (with my tax dollars). Many times the cost of the Marshall Plan (which rebuilt Europe after WW2) has been spent on domestic programs designed to uplift AAs. And what is the result? The results are devastating, things are worse off for their communities than they were in 1960.

    So after all of this and the outcomes are still not equal, what is a progressive to do? Well there must be some invisible hand holding down the AA, and since we can’t see it, it must be everywhere. It must be ingrained into the very fiber of all white people. Our simple existence must be the reason AAs still aren’t at the same level. Of course, don’t look at any other minority immigrant community. Don’t look at the fact that hispanics have come in (illegally and legally) by the millions in the last 40 years and have already exceeded domestic AAs.

    So yes, there must be evil whitey still keeping AAs down. It’s funny, people used to joke about the same thing in the 1970s, except “systemic racism” was casually referred to as “The Man” who kept the black man down.

    1. LarrytheG Avatar
      LarrytheG

      re: ” The results are devastating, things are worse off for their communities than they were in 1960.”

      True. That was the year after Massive Resistance ended. All good after that, can’t explain why not.

      1. Eric the half a troll Avatar
        Eric the half a troll

        Sorry but the Black community is better today than in 1960.

        1. LarrytheG Avatar
          LarrytheG

          and way, way better than 1860….

    2. Eric the half a troll Avatar
      Eric the half a troll

      “And what is the result? The results are devastating, things are worse off for their communities than they were in 1960.”

      In 1960, 50%+ of blacks lived in poverty. Today that rate is in the teens. By any measure this is a success.

      https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/35e6c4c505e288afe55675472aa17dcbf88ce2bdf19294645476a58df633944c.jpg

      1. It’s not clear from the data, but why did the poverty rate decline? Was it because blacks became higher earners and more self reliant, or because of higher welfare payouts, or some other reason?

        1. LarrytheG Avatar
          LarrytheG

          more and more black men in prison for selling illegal drugs which they do if they can’t get a decent job which they do if they barely have a high school education?

          Then with a prison record added to the other, even less chance of a job.

          So, yes, more entitlements targeted to kids, like TANF and Medicaid and child tax credit, free & reduced lunch.

          not just black kids. High percents of white folks also get these entitlements.

          1. We agree on the importance of education. Are there white policies that encourage black kids to drop out?

          2. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            I don’t know. If we look at schools like Richmond, Petersburg, that are run by black folks (or other similar cities), is the dropout rate worse than say in places like Fairfax or Charlottesville or other “white” city schools?

          3. That seems to be an important metric to explore. It seems strange that the black community would not value education as a means of escaping poverty. In any case, I doubt that whites would have much success going into the black community and telling young blacks to stay in school; that’s something the black community would have to commit to.
            In any case, I think this raises a question about the charge of systemic racism. Lack of education seems to be the driver for the poverty. The schools are there, but the students don’t attend. Since the black community is poor, the schools are paid for by the wealthier (white) communities, but the blacks reject the opportunity offered by them. That rejection seems to be a major factor in the poverty we see, which raises the question does the focus needs to be changed from white racism to black poor judgement. Solving that would require reforms in the black community, and the liberal approach, so I don’t think it likely, and sadly another generation will be sacrificed.

          4. That seems to be an important metric to explore. It seems strange that the black community would not value education as a means of escaping poverty. In any case, I doubt that whites would have much success going into the black community and telling young blacks to stay in school; that’s something the black community would have to commit to.
            In any case, I think this raises a question about the charge of systemic racism. Lack of education seems to be the driver for the poverty. The schools are there, but the students don’t attend. Since the black community is poor, the schools are paid for by the wealthier (white) communities, but the blacks reject the opportunity offered by them. That rejection seems to be a major factor in the poverty we see, which raises the question does the focus needs to be changed from white racism to black poor judgement. Solving that would require reforms in the black community, and the liberal approach, so I don’t think it likely, and sadly another generation will be sacrificed.

          5. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            If you have a child from a household that the parents are themselves without a good education and their jobs are low paying and often not permanent… the childs home may be temporary, the child might be at home alone at times… or send to live with Grandma for 3 months and then
            back to mom, etc… point is… kids in poverty live in unstable circumstances that are not the
            best for being in school on a regular basis, learning to read, etc….

            To characterize the above circumstances as the parents “rejecting”, I think grossly misunderstands some realities.

            You and others can blame the parents but the parents themselves lack basic education and lack basic reading and math skills that would qualify them even for minimum wage jobs. They ought not to be having kids in the first place but they engage in sex like all young folks but lack easy/free access to birth control or even abortions.

            Try being a kid and moving around every six months to a different school because mom had to change apartments or jobs… etc.. that’s your issue .. .not ‘rejection” of opportunity.

          6. Yes, the problem is severe. Yes, the kids have a tough time of it.

            You blame white prople who can’t fix the problem and excuse the black community who are the only ones who can fix it. As I said, another generation sacrificed.

          7. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            I don’t blame white people and excuse black people at all. I’m saying that people (of any color) who have minimal educations , low paying jobs and a chaotic family life that has them moving around – is more than “tough on the kids… it’s central and fundamental to those kids repeating the failures of their parents.

            What are the real issues? What are responses to it? Charter/voucher schools? How would they “fix” it?

          8. You say ‘I don’t blame white people and excuse black people at all’.
            You’ve been blaming it all on white racism that denied access to health care.

            Then you give us an explanation that excuses blacks because life is hard.
            Then you ask ‘what are the real issues’?

            Don’t you know?

            Perhaps the real issue is clinging to failed policies for 55 years, and demonizing anyone who dares to question the liberal orthodoxy. Prior to the War on Poverty, blacks had fathers who had jobs and got educations despite the hardships of Jim Crow.

          9. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            I did for health care because it’s demonstrably true but that’s not the kid issue.

            It’s not “life is hard” . That’s not an answer and simply not the truth either.
            There are systemic issues that are not the fault of the child.

            I laid out at least some of the issues involving a repeating cycle of a kid that fails to get
            an education, grows up, can’t find a decent job because they lack an education, have
            kids… and the cycle repeats.

            What is a “failed policy for 55 years” ? what failed?

            I’d ask you HOW black fathers had good educations and good jobs BEFORE the war
            on poverty, when Jim Crow and Massive Resistance actually DENIED many/most of them an education? How do you believe they got good educations ?

            They not only did not have an education, many/most had menial, low paying jobs that did not provide health care nor pensions compared to those who did have good educations and good jobs with health insurance and pensions? They could not build wealth, own their homes, provide for college for their kids….

  10. Peter Galuszka Avatar
    Peter Galuszka

    When reading Bacon, it is always important to be attentive to what he DOESN’T say. Here he goes talking about how lack of access to funds for health care in the South is one reason why Blacks there generally have worse health. JAB notes that one factor is that delays in expanding Medicaid has been one factor. Not stated is that in Virginia ,White, conservative politicians recently delayed expanding Medicaid for four years even though 90 percent of the money came from the federal government. Racism, anyone?

    1. LarrytheG Avatar
      LarrytheG

      yes, barely mentioned, but until a very few years ago, (more than a hundred years after slavery), many people of color, had virtually no access to quality health care and could not afford it, nor the care of a doctor to help them manage obesity, diabetes , etc , like people who DO have access to good health care.

      Many Conservatives today are STILL opposed to Medicaid and the ACA which they cite as the reason for the deficit and debt and have promised to repeat and reject and tear out root and branch.

    2. VaNavVet Avatar

      Now 40 states have expanded Medicaid. The Republicans in Virginia were clearly on the wrong side of history.

      1. Lefty665 Avatar

        The Repubs in the Virginia General Assembly were on the wrong side of history and decency the moment they voted down the Medicare expansion.

    3. The 90% comes from federal taxes we pay. The key phrase is ‘we pay’.

      1. LarrytheG Avatar
        LarrytheG

        You pay for Medicare and Employer-provided insurance also, right?

    4. Nancy Naive Avatar
      Nancy Naive

      Well, NC just expanded MedicAid, but unsatisfied with improving social conditions, they now want to make participation trophies illegal.

      Go figure.

      Does this mean that the National Defense Medal will be illegal in NC?

      1. LarrytheG Avatar
        LarrytheG

        Curious what Conservatives priorities are or seem to be… yep.

        healthcare for folks that don’t have it?

        nope… gotta pull it out root & branch…

  11. VaNavVet Avatar

    Understanding of social dynamics has a ways to go as does that of JAB. There is no mention of implicit bias and the fact that so many poor whites in the South grew up looking down on poor blacks and hating successful ones as in Tulsa.

  12. Eric the half a troll Avatar
    Eric the half a troll

    “However, it escapes the notice of the Pilot’s pontificators that the challenges afflicting poor African Americans are pretty much the same as the challenges afflicting poor Whites…”

    This ignores the stats that while Whites in South Carolina (for instance) are 67% of the population, only 10% of them live in poverty while Blacks only make up 26% of the population and 25% of them live in poverty. Yours is not an apples to apples comparison. The population of Blacks in the South as a community are facing much larger challenges and they are there because of a system that was designed specifically to keep them there.

    1. Lefty665 Avatar

      From the percentages you quote roughly equal numbers of black and white people are in poverty in South Carolina. They have achieved “equity” in poverty as well as “diversity” in poverty and “inclusion” in poverty.

      Is everyone happy now?

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