Bacon Bits: Encampments and Memorials

Globalize this! Nearly two-thirds (65%) of Americans recently polled by the Foundation for Individual Rights and Expression (FIRE) responded that setting up pro-Palestinian tent compounds was “never” or “rarely” justified. Nearly half (47%) said that students participating in college encampment protests should be expelled, suspended, or put on probation. Only 23% thought the demonstrators should not be punished at all.

But breaking university rules against round-the-clock camping on college campuses and chanting, “Globalize the intifada,” pales in comparison to burning the American flag. Eighty percent responded that flag burning is never or rarely justified.

FIRE did not ask about protesters who erected an encampment and burned the flag. View the detailed survey results here.

Explain again, please, why so many statues came down. The Public Religion Research Institute has released polling results for questions on a wide array of issues relating to race relations that are worth examining. What caught our attention were a series of questions about Confederate memorials and statues. While 45% of the 5,500 respondents from around the country view the Confederate flag as a symbol of racism (and 54% say it reflects Southern pride), only 33% regard statues to Confederate soldiers that way (and 63% say they reflect Southern pride).

Fewer than one in ten of those polled embrace removing the statues and then melting them down, as happened to the Robert E. Lee statue in Charlottesville. Only 37% support removing the statues at all. Thirty-five percent endorse the idea of keeping the statues and adding context about slavery and racism, and 26% would like to just leave them alone. The numbers have barely budged over the past two years.

If a large majority of Americans favor the idea of keeping the statues, how did so many get torn down? As occasional Bacon’s Rebellion contributor Don Smith explained to me over breakfast this morning, the statues were erected in prominent places. In the late 1800s/early 1900s, some of the most prominent places were in city centers. Today those city centers are dominated by electorates comprised disproportionately of African-Americans, who understandably are less sympathetic to the memorials, and educated elites, who place great store in signaling their virtue on matters of race.

I’d like to see a poll asking what should be done with memorials to slaveholders… like George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, and James Madison.


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35 responses to “Bacon Bits: Encampments and Memorials”

  1. walter smith Avatar
    walter smith

    So, why did UVA hasten to take down the George Rogers Clark statue, brother of the Lewis and Clark Clark, but himself known as "Conqueror of the Northwest"? 5 States admitted into the Union. None slave States. Were the "Native Americans" praising his separating from the Brits/French/Canadians or were they being subservient? Why did UVA give Indian tribes from all over the country the right to decide? Seriously, folks. Basically between the hospital and the White Spot if you can remember it. Other than crazy faculty (Monacan land acknowledgement required!) and maybe a dozen (?) local activists, was anyone truly offended? How much money to take it down? And the Feckless BOV (TM) just rubber-stamped it…

    1. Eric the half a troll Avatar
      Eric the half a troll

      Will the shadow board re-erect the statue, Walt… on the agenda…?

      1. walter smith Avatar
        walter smith

        I don't know Troll. Neither the real BOV or "the shadow BOV" – ooh…so scawy for the Troll!
        Conspiracy theory much?
        And let's try something substantive, which may be impossible for you.
        Why should the statue of the Revolutionary War hero, Conqueror of the Northwest, have been removed? Tell us in all your Lefty brilliance.

        1. Eric the half a troll Avatar
          Eric the half a troll

          Walt, clearly in all the research you did into the issue you must have come across the reasons proffered for it’s removal… enlighten us…

          1. walter smith Avatar
            walter smith

            Troll – it is impossible to enlighten you – you’re a Troll!
            So, in the effort to help you, you should try to figure it out yourself. And this shouldn’t be that hard. It was a deranged Leftist decision. What do deranged Leftists use for every decision?

          2. James Wyatt Whitehead Avatar
            James Wyatt Whitehead

            Walt. The Trolley is playing you for his own amusement. Just block the guy. It's as close to a digital black eye as you can get.

          3. Eric the half a troll Avatar
            Eric the half a troll

            So you don’t even know. Well here, this may help you….

            “The statue, which was unveiled in November 1921, depicts what appears to be the moment before a murder. Clark, who was born in Albemarle County, is dubbed the “Conqueror of the Northwest” on the plinth, rides high atop his horse, a couple of his men behind him, charging into a group of Native American people — including a woman with a baby wrapped in a cradleboard.

            Clark fought against the British and both with and against Indigenous nations, whose loyalties to the British, the Americans, the French or other Native American nations, varied by tribe, Bigelow said. Clark constantly turned his back on — and murdered — people who thought him to be an ally, she added.

            “He eliminated entire communities, because he did not see a path forward to nationhood [that included] Indian nations,” said Bigelow. “What he did would now be called ethnic cleansing.””

          4. walter smith Avatar
            walter smith

            So, your real name is Allison Bigelow, xxxxxx Indian activist of UVA? Or were you on the “committee?” Do you think Jim Ryan knew when he appointed Ms. Bigelow, xxxxxx Indian activist, that she would come to the pre-ordained desire of removal for Great and Good? I lived in Charlottesville almost continuously for a 9 year period and passed the statue maybe 3 or 4 hundred times. No one ever complained about it, and no cared when removed except for a couple dozen Leftists, bent on destroying America. And I’m not sure I would trust Ms. Bigelow’s characterizations, given that she is an xxxxxxz Indian activist…

          5. CJBova Avatar

            Walter is expanding on Eric's comment to explain who Bigelow is.

          6. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            Wasn't she appointed to serve on a committee to carry out the vote of the BOV?

            https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/d11c388deacd2f99403028818d0639c75717eafffc574e81537683e0b2c0d5a1.png

          7. Eric the half a troll Avatar
            Eric the half a troll

            Just helping you move forward in your honest quest for understanding, Walt. You did not notice this statue in 9 years… apparently others did… and also noticed what it showed… given the description provided, it seems that the group who asked for its removal had a solid point. Would you like to provide evidence as to why their position is incorrect?

            Btw, implied in your haranguing of Ms. Bigelow is a doubt in activists’ claims of Native American ancestry. If true, in this you harken back to Walter Plecker, the State Registrar of Vital Statistics in the 40s. In 1940, when explaining why he returned one man’s birth certificate, he wrote the following: “We have learned that none of the native-born individuals in Virginia claiming to be Indian are free from negro mixture, and under the law of Virginia every person with any ascertainable degree of negro blood is to be classed as a negro or colored person not as an Indian.” To another person claiming to be Indian, he wrote: “We do not recognize any native-born Indian as of pure Indian descent unmixed with negro blood. According to the law of Virginia any ascertainable degree of negro blood constitutes the individual a colored person.” Finally, after assiduous research in 1943 he claimed: “Public records in the office of the Bureau of Vital Statistics, and in the State Library, indicate that there does not exist today a descendant of the Virginia ancestors claiming to be an Indian who is unmixed with negro blood.”

            This from this article which also may help you in your quest for understanding.

            https://news.virginia.edu/c

          8. walter smith Avatar
            walter smith

            You are the one injecting race Troll. Bigelow is an Indian activist. Had nothing to do with race. I’m sure you are offended by Fauxcahontas, aren’t you? Isn’t there some Lefty term for that?
            But, since you approve of twelve people getting rid of things in the public domain for 100 years, I guess I’ll have to round up all the fellow offended and create a pre-ordained committee to get rid of it.

  2. Eric the half a troll Avatar
    Eric the half a troll

    “…and chanting, “Globalize the intifada,”…”

    Hmmm… did not see that question asked…

    “…pales in comparison to burning the American flag. Eighty percent responded that flag burning is never or rarely justified….”

    What was the response when asked if it was a protected right to do so….?

    1. Nancy Naive Avatar
      Nancy Naive

      They pointed to a Trump flag and said, “‘Merica…”

  3. Nancy Naive Avatar
    Nancy Naive

    who’d they poll? only those wearing MAGA caps?

    1. James Wyatt Whitehead Avatar
      James Wyatt Whitehead
      1. Nancy Naive Avatar
        Nancy Naive

        That strikes me as painful.

  4. LarrytheG Avatar
    LarrytheG

    Bloody Angle , a National Battlefield Park near me, has not had a single memorial taken down nor defaced.

    In fact, there are a number of Battlefield Parks in the Fredericksburg area and as far as I know, none have been taken down nor defaced.

    Now, we also do not have a single one that was put up by the Daughters of the Confederacy that anyone would characterize as "lost cause".

    We have no heroic generals astride their horses or similar, either.

    Here's what we do have:

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/0a1e9f2481a7d24dee1bffe01b25a16ce2206d63bef4ff922f044d86f1c09c1d.png

  5. LarrytheG Avatar
    LarrytheG

    So why do some "memorials" get taken down and others not? Is it happenstance or some other reason or logic on the part of those who would take them down?

    There are thousands, hundreds of thousands of memorials that have not been taken down and suffer no risk of it happening to them.

    Why?

  6. Eric the half a troll Avatar
    Eric the half a troll

    Seems like Don answered your question for you… next…?

    1. Nancy Naive Avatar
      Nancy Naive

      Don can only impart knowledge, not understanding.

      Hmmmm, pro-Palestinian encampment outside a synagogue… slave owner statues in black neighborhoods…

      Nope! Nope! Can’t see any similarities… nope, sure can’t.

    2. Nancy Naive Avatar
      Nancy Naive

      Don can only impart knowledge, not understanding.

      Hmmmm, pro-Palestinian encampment outside a synagogue… slave owner statues in black neighborhoods…

      Nope! Nope! Can’t see any similarities… nope, sure can’t.

      1. Donald Smith Avatar
        Donald Smith

        I have to agree with you there, Nancy. It's often very hard to understand (or fathom) what wokeists do.

    3. Donald Smith Avatar
      Donald Smith

      Jim, I guess Eric has confirmed it—the woke anti-statue educated elites really are just virtue-signaling. Or, they really are triggered by those statues. Either way, I think a critical mass of Americans are getting tired of those people. And people wonder why Trump is so popular…

      1. Eric the half a troll Avatar
        Eric the half a troll

        My name is not Jim…

        …and you seemed to have forgotten the point you reportedly made at breakfast about who lives near these statues and their desire to simply be represented by their local government… and you were so close too… alas…

  7. Nancy Naive Avatar
    Nancy Naive

    incredibly scary moment filming sleeping sharks …
    https://www.facebook.com/GHHSA/videos/shark-surprise/321503364053851/?_rdr

  8. Seems like a low sample size even for Virginia, much less all Americans.

  9. GeorgeWallaceandGromit Avatar
    GeorgeWallaceandGromit

    These rhetorical questions and the feigned confusion conservatives exhibit have had no success in making progress against issues you care about. You allow the left to define the goalposts and only respond with defensive arguments.

  10. I initiated and coordinated the campaign to remove the George Rogers Clark memorial statue. I co-founded NAIS@uva, an informal collective that has initiated many of the steps that UVA has taken to include Native Americans in President Ryan’s administration. I am also a Native American and an alumnus of UVA with professional expertise in the field of historic preservation. Suffice it to say that our campaign did not merely call for the removal of the statue, we asked that it be replaced with substantive programs, tenured faculty positions, admissions improvements, and more respectful policies and practices regarding Native Americans at UVA. Why did we ask for the statue’s removal? Because it was a settler-colonial trophy that celebrated genocide of Indigenous peoples, it depicted Virginia military personnel attacking a family of Native Americans including a woman holding a baby. Plus it was one of the only Native American oriented features at UVA. To this day UVA allocates zero space to the Native American community. The former statue location was the only space that included us as there are no permanent Native American academic programs at UVA. Indeed, UVA in its entire 200+ year history has had zero or very close to zero tenured U.S. recognized Native American faculty members. We asked for the statue to be replaced with substantive programs that would result in our permanent inclusion at UVA. How could UVA be a great American university without Native American programs and scholars? We also ask that our Native American scholars of history be included in the ongoing Digital Contextualization of Thomas Jefferson project that was approved by the Board of Visitors. The readers of this website should welcome a fair and thorough accounting of Jefferson’s legacy in regard to the Native American Nations and peoples, including his role concerning Native American boarding schools, the Indebtedness strategy, the Indian removal policy, the Doctrine of Discovery, US westward expansion and subsequent wars of resistance, and other subjects involving Jefferson’s Indigenous legacy including Indigenous grave-desecration practices of American archaeologists.
    In closing I refer you to this site:

    https://founding.com/founders-library/government-documents/american-state-and-local-government-documents/report-to-the-commissioners-of-the-university-of-virginia-the-rockfish-gap-report-thomas-jefferson-1818/

    wherein one can find Jefferson’s bigoted and disparaging remarks in regard to Indigenous knowledge —

    ”What, but education, has advanced us beyond the condition of our indigenous neighbors? And what chains them to their present state of barbarism and wretchedness, but a bigotted veneration for the supposed superlative wisdom of their fathers, and the preposterous idea that they are to look backward for better things, and not forward, longing, as it should seem, to return to the days of eating acorns and roots, rather than indulge in the degeneracies of civilization? ”.

    Anthony Guy Lopez

    1. LarrytheG Avatar
      LarrytheG

      Thank you for being open and transparent enough to post here and receive comments.

    2. James Wyatt Whitehead Avatar
      James Wyatt Whitehead

      Well, if Jefferson was so bigoted how do you explain this?
      https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/4a7313ddd42eb769d03484cd63c85112fa1767e98daa46dac72b43f1e3e1cfe3.jpg

      1. Did you read Jefferson’s words in the source I provided? From my reading he disparages Indigenous cultural knowledge as well as our reverence for our elders. But there is more – in Jefferson’s dismissive statement he also rejects oral history and the oral-based agreements that Indigenous nations made with settlers. That Jefferson collected Indigenous artifacts is neither here or there. More important are his written statements- the one I provided, the damning history in “Jefferson and the Indians”, and his derogatory judgements in “Notes on the State of Virginia.”

        1. James Wyatt Whitehead Avatar
          James Wyatt Whitehead

          Burn it all down. Got it.

  11. f/k/a_tmtfairfax Avatar
    f/k/a_tmtfairfax

    How about the former president and my distant cousin, Barack Obama? Both of us are descended from Mareen "the Emigrant" Duvall. Duvall came as an indentured servant and ended as a slaveholder. No one is going to create a statue of me, but I suspect there will be several of my cousin — unless our shared ancestor cancels the President.

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