Bacon's Rebellion

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Abbott COVID-19 Rapid Testing Re-Visited

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by

James A. Bacon
in

An Abbott ID NOW testing device for COVID-19.

by James C. Sherlock

When Virginia Secretary of Health and Human Resources Dr. Daniel Carey spoke yesterday at the Governor’s press conference, he mentioned that the state had received some Abbott ID NOW platforms from FEMA, but that they were too few to be of any use.  Yet ID NOW platforms are point-of-care systems used at physicians offices, urgent care clinics, and others from which you may have gotten quick results on such ailments as strep throat in the past.

Abbott has authorization to use an ID NOW test module that can detect a COVID-19 positive result within three minutes and be confirmed negative within 15 minutes while you wait. Utilization of this technology could provide invaluable real-time data to help public health authorities combat the disease and quickly increase the numbers of people that are tested and the speed at which they are treated.

However, judging by their comments yesterday, the Secretary and his Health Commissioner have no information on the preexisting presence of those platforms currently in place in Virginia. There are now more than now more than 18,000 in operation in the U.S.  If the platforms are distributed in rough proportion to state populations, between 400 and 500 should be in operation in Virginia.

Abbott’s daily shipment of more than 50,000 COVID test modules daily equates to three per day per ID NOW platform in the Unites States. It is unlikely that shipments are perfectly evenly distributed around the country. But the numbers suggest that many people with symptoms could get the rapid test if Governor Northam emulated the Governor of Georgia and organized point-of-care rapid results testing in Virginia. Moving forward, the Abbott technology clearly will be one of the quickest and cheapest tests for larger and larger swaths of the population.

I have today (Saturday) provided information on Abbott Rapid COVID-19 testing and the statistically likely broad distribution of ID NOW platforms in Virginia to the Virginia Emergency Operations Center. I also gave them the direct phone number of Abbott Laboratories Molecular Division in Illinois. I had checked and the Molecular Division is working today. The EOC’s Emergency Support Function (ESF) #8 Public Health and Medical Services desk can call Abbott directly and get information as to who currently runs their ID NOW platform in Virginia and where the systems are located. They can also check on shipments of the COVID-19 test module to Virginia.

I hope we will hear about the results of that inquiry at the Governor’s Monday press conference.

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57 responses to “Abbott COVID-19 Rapid Testing Re-Visited”

  1. Acbar Avatar
    Acbar

    Thank you, Jim, for the initiative to apply public pressure on our politicians in ways like this. Maybe Northam isn’t Cuomo but at least he knows how politicians can win praise, or be undone. If this is to be the crisis that’s solved from the bottom up at the federal level, we may have to use the same technique in Virginia.

    1. sherlockj Avatar
      sherlockj

      Such pandemics were always intended to be solved from the bottom up, by local health departments and then state health departments supported by the federal government, not the other way around. If the state pandemic emergency response plan had not been taken down from the state website to hide it from view, you could read it and see that.

      1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
        Reed Fawell 3rd

        Do not forget this key point by Jim S. above.
        “Such pandemics were always intended to be solved from the bottom up, by local health departments and then state health departments supported by the federal government, not the other way around. If the state pandemic emergency response plan had not been taken down from the state website to hide it from view, you could read it and see that.”

    2. Acbar Avatar
      Acbar

      Doesn’t Abbott know where its test readers are? SOP is for new device purchasers to register for warranty coverage, etc. – doesn’t Abbott have this for at least recent purchasers?

  2. cjbova Avatar
    cjbova

    This transcription from Governor Northam’s press appearance on April 6 may explain why the Virginia Secretary of Health and Human Resources downplayed the Abbott testing platform. From what the governor said, the state lab is focusing on genome work and not testing in the state. This may also explain the “priority investigative criteria” the VDH has used in its testing guidance since March 20th.

    “NEWS FROM OUR STATE LAB
    “Our Division of Consolidated Laboratory Services is starting to use genetic technology to help our public health officials to better understand COVID-19. DCLS is doing this work alongside the CDC and international public health and university partners. They are building a library of genetic information from the positive tests DCLS gets, as well as those from private labs, health systems and university systems in Virginia.

    “One insight they have already learned, it appears that the virus was introduced in Virginia in multiple communities rather than spreading from one single source.

    “I’m proud that DCLS is one of the first public health labs in the nation to do this very sophisticated work. This will help our public health officials understand the virus, how it spreads and how it may change, and that may help give us more tools to fight it.

    “Let’s move on to a note just a bit on testing. Virginia, like other states, has not been able to get the volume of testing materials that we need to do widespread testing. Sentara Healthcare has announced that it is starting to do in-house testing which will allow for faster processing time for tests at hospitals in the Sentara network. This is a positive step. We continue to work as fast as we can on testing that will have a 15 to 30 minute turnaround. And I thank all who have been a part of this goal.”

    1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
      Reed Fawell 3rd

      Thank you Carol for this:

      “DCLS is doing this work alongside the CDC and international public health and university partners. They are building a library of genetic information from the positive tests DCLS gets, as well as those from private labs, health systems and university systems in Virginia.”

      This is another version of the University of Virginia’s stated strategy of “taking the long view” of crisis combined with seeking donations from outsiders to fund it.

      In practical affect, it would appear, that the state of Virginia and its universities, including UVA, have abandoned Virginia’s citizens, whether they be dead or alive, on an active field of battle, to fend for themselves as best they can with the help of strangers outside the state, if any be found.

  3. sherlockj Avatar
    sherlockj

    I am afraid that the University of Virginia has been slandered here as having “abandoned Virginia’s citizens”. Please go to https://research.virginia.edu/covid-19-research-news. See in particular:
    Staff, Faculty Across Grounds Unite to 3-D Print, Create, Donate Critical Medical Supplies
    UVA Joins National Trial to Test Potential COVID-19 Medication
    The long game: UVA researchers shift focus to COVID-19
    UVA Health Independently Develops New COVID-19 Tests
    UVA researchers racing to develop COVID-19 vaccine and test
    UVA Health Offering COVID-19 Testing to Virginia Hospitals
    UVA researchers may have found faster way to detect COVID-19
    Biocomplexity Researchers Working With Health Officials to Predict Coronavirus’ Spread

    1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
      Reed Fawell 3rd

      Where are hard results? Where are the tests delivered. Best I can discern its been a very weak performance by UVA, one that started off very slow, and got no quicker, and needed to an outside private million dollar grant to get going. That does not strike me as the performance worthy of a first class research university, after all the money spent by taxpayers and students, and all the over the top bragging we’ve been hearing for the last decade. Be interesting to compare to University of Maryland, and Johns Hopkins, not to mention private firms that are actually efficient and competent and get things done, along with nurses and so many other low paid health workers working their tails off, solving real on the ground threats.

  4. Acbar Avatar
    Acbar

    Thank you, Jim, for the initiative to apply public pressure on our politicians in ways like this. Maybe Northam isn’t Cuomo but at least he knows how politicians can win praise, or be undone. If this is to be the crisis that’s solved from the bottom up at the federal level, we may have to use the same technique in Virginia.

    1. sherlockj Avatar
      sherlockj

      Such pandemics were always intended to be solved from the bottom up, by local health departments and then state health departments supported by the federal government, not the other way around. If the state pandemic emergency response plan had not been taken down from the state website to hide it from view, you could read it and see that.

      1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
        Reed Fawell 3rd

        Do not forget this key point by Jim S. above.
        “Such pandemics were always intended to be solved from the bottom up, by local health departments and then state health departments supported by the federal government, not the other way around. If the state pandemic emergency response plan had not been taken down from the state website to hide it from view, you could read it and see that.”

    2. Acbar Avatar
      Acbar

      Doesn’t Abbott know where its test readers are? SOP is for new device purchasers to register for warranty coverage, etc. – doesn’t Abbott have this for at least recent purchasers?

  5. cjbova Avatar
    cjbova

    This transcription from Governor Northam’s press appearance on April 6 may explain why the Virginia Secretary of Health and Human Resources downplayed the Abbott testing platform. From what the governor said, the state lab is focusing on genome work and not testing in the state. This may also explain the “priority investigative criteria” the VDH has used in its testing guidance since March 20th.

    “NEWS FROM OUR STATE LAB
    “Our Division of Consolidated Laboratory Services is starting to use genetic technology to help our public health officials to better understand COVID-19. DCLS is doing this work alongside the CDC and international public health and university partners. They are building a library of genetic information from the positive tests DCLS gets, as well as those from private labs, health systems and university systems in Virginia.

    “One insight they have already learned, it appears that the virus was introduced in Virginia in multiple communities rather than spreading from one single source.

    “I’m proud that DCLS is one of the first public health labs in the nation to do this very sophisticated work. This will help our public health officials understand the virus, how it spreads and how it may change, and that may help give us more tools to fight it.

    “Let’s move on to a note just a bit on testing. Virginia, like other states, has not been able to get the volume of testing materials that we need to do widespread testing. Sentara Healthcare has announced that it is starting to do in-house testing which will allow for faster processing time for tests at hospitals in the Sentara network. This is a positive step. We continue to work as fast as we can on testing that will have a 15 to 30 minute turnaround. And I thank all who have been a part of this goal.”

    1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
      Reed Fawell 3rd

      Thank you Carol for this:

      “DCLS is doing this work alongside the CDC and international public health and university partners. They are building a library of genetic information from the positive tests DCLS gets, as well as those from private labs, health systems and university systems in Virginia.”

      This is another version of the University of Virginia’s stated strategy of “taking the long view” of crisis combined with seeking donations from outsiders to fund it.

      In practical affect, it would appear, that the state of Virginia and its universities, including UVA, have abandoned Virginia’s citizens, whether they be dead or alive, on an active field of battle, to fend for themselves as best they can with the help of strangers outside the state, if any be found.

  6. djrippert Avatar
    djrippert

    Like other states? Lol. Over the last three days Maryland, with 3/4 of Virginia’s population, ran just under double the number of tests per day as were run in Virginia.

    Orangeman may be bad but Coonman is worse,

    https://covidtracking.com/data/state/virginia#historical

    1. Steve Haner Avatar
      Steve Haner

      I suspect the truth is that the tests are being run by several entities and the state VDH is just not capturing the data. If somebody walks into a Doc In A Box and that office has this Abbott set up, which is not new technology – just a new disease to test – the results may not be reported to anybody but the patient, especially if its negative. A recent random sample in Germany found antibodies in 15% of the population already- 15% of 8 million Virginians is 1.2 million who may have been exposed, most without any idea. The numbers from VDH and from VHHA are worthless. VHHA would know the hospitalization # and while there is a lag, the death numbers are about as solid as any. And that’s what has our undivided attention.

      And for that, while the data lags by a week or more, watch this space from CDC: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/COVID19/index.htm
      Note it is updated weekly, and the April 9 update was data received through April 4. It nicely refutes another false meme working its way around social media, that COVID-19 is now a leading cause of death. Not even close.

      1. cjbova Avatar
        cjbova

        Steve Haner, you’re right. VDH is getting information on negative tests from labs that it is not reporting. Footnote to VDH daily testing total: “Test Results Received by Public Health From All Reporting Labs. All negative results may not be represented due to the large number of fax reports from new labs testing for COVID-19.”

        Since the testing guidelines say “Clinicians are strongly encouraged to test for other causes of respiratory illness (e.g., influenza),” is anyone trying to find out how many are getting those results on Abbott’s machines?

        Does VDH report all Online Morbidity Reports from clinicians as cases?? And are clinicians complying and reporting?
        “Clinical diagnosis of COVID-19 is a reportable condition, regardless of whether testing is pursued or not. Clinicians should utilize the VDH Online Morbidity Report Portal to report individual cases that do not meet the criteria for DCLS testing noted above.”

      2. Acbar Avatar
        Acbar

        You make a good point, Steve, the one stat we have a good handle on is deaths. Is there reliable data from anywhere else, where there really is widespread testing, like South Korea, to provide a basis for extrapolating from deaths to likely total # of infections (known and unknown/asymptomatic)?

      3. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
        Reed Fawell 3rd

        Steve’s points confirm precisely what Jim S. predicted here in his reporting back in January, and what he try to tell Virginia officials long before, yet it appears he has been long ignored.

        Hence, comments by Steve such as these:

        “The numbers from VDH and from VHHA are worthless. VHHA would know the hospitalization # and while there is a lag, the death numbers are about as solid as any. And that’s what has our undivided attention.

        And for that, while the data lags by a week or more, watch this space from CDC: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/COVID19/index.htm
        Note it is updated weekly, and the April 9 update was data received through April 4. It nicely refutes another false meme working its way around social media, that COVID-19 is now a leading cause of death. Not even close.”

  7. djrippert Avatar
    djrippert

    Like other states? Lol. Over the last three days Maryland, with 3/4 of Virginia’s population, ran just under double the number of tests per day as were run in Virginia.

    Orangeman may be bad but Coonman is worse,

    https://covidtracking.com/data/state/virginia#historical

    1. Steve Haner Avatar
      Steve Haner

      I suspect the truth is that the tests are being run by several entities and the state VDH is just not capturing the data. If somebody walks into a Doc In A Box and that office has this Abbott set up, which is not new technology – just a new disease to test – the results may not be reported to anybody but the patient, especially if its negative. A recent random sample in Germany found antibodies in 15% of the population already- 15% of 8 million Virginians is 1.2 million who may have been exposed, most without any idea. The numbers from VDH and from VHHA are worthless. VHHA would know the hospitalization # and while there is a lag, the death numbers are about as solid as any. And that’s what has our undivided attention.

      And for that, while the data lags by a week or more, watch this space from CDC: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/COVID19/index.htm
      Note it is updated weekly, and the April 9 update was data received through April 4. It nicely refutes another false meme working its way around social media, that COVID-19 is now a leading cause of death. Not even close.

      1. cjbova Avatar
        cjbova

        Steve Haner, you’re right. VDH is getting information on negative tests from labs that it is not reporting. Footnote to VDH daily testing total: “Test Results Received by Public Health From All Reporting Labs. All negative results may not be represented due to the large number of fax reports from new labs testing for COVID-19.”

        Since the testing guidelines say “Clinicians are strongly encouraged to test for other causes of respiratory illness (e.g., influenza),” is anyone trying to find out how many are getting those results on Abbott’s machines?

        Does VDH report all Online Morbidity Reports from clinicians as cases?? And are clinicians complying and reporting?
        “Clinical diagnosis of COVID-19 is a reportable condition, regardless of whether testing is pursued or not. Clinicians should utilize the VDH Online Morbidity Report Portal to report individual cases that do not meet the criteria for DCLS testing noted above.”

  8. djrippert Avatar
    djrippert

    So, Virginia’s Secretary of Health and Human Resources doesn’t realize that these Abbott devices are already out in the field? He thinks that these are new devices that will only be useful after they are shipped to Virginia by Abbott? While this is just another example of the failure of Virginia’s state government under the Democrats you’d think it would be easy to fix. Someone needs to tell Dr. Carey to look a bit harder across Virginia for the existing Abbott devices. Obviously, Ralph Northam won’t be doing the telling. He seems to be a deer caught in COVID-19 headlights. Fine. He’ll be blessedly gone from office soon. But what about the other so-called leaders among the Democrats in Virginia? Where is Dick Saslaw? Where is Eileen Filler-Corn? Where is Janet Howell? Somebody please – throw our Democrtic Governor a lifeline, he’s drowning.

    1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
      Reed Fawell 3rd

      “Where is Dick Saslaw? Where is Eileen Filler-Corn? Where is Janet Howell?”

      Caught in the same headlights as Northam, apparently, after all it is the Virginia Way.

  9. djrippert Avatar
    djrippert

    So, Virginia’s Secretary of Health and Human Resources doesn’t realize that these Abbott devices are already out in the field? He thinks that these are new devices that will only be useful after they are shipped to Virginia by Abbott? While this is just another example of the failure of Virginia’s state government under the Democrats you’d think it would be easy to fix. Someone needs to tell Dr. Carey to look a bit harder across Virginia for the existing Abbott devices. Obviously, Ralph Northam won’t be doing the telling. He seems to be a deer caught in COVID-19 headlights. Fine. He’ll be blessedly gone from office soon. But what about the other so-called leaders among the Democrats in Virginia? Where is Dick Saslaw? Where is Eileen Filler-Corn? Where is Janet Howell? Somebody please – throw our Democrtic Governor a lifeline, he’s drowning.

    1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
      Reed Fawell 3rd

      “Where is Dick Saslaw? Where is Eileen Filler-Corn? Where is Janet Howell?”

      Caught in the same headlights as Northam, apparently, after all it is the Virginia Way.

  10. sherlockj Avatar
    sherlockj

    I am afraid that the University of Virginia has been slandered here as having “abandoned Virginia’s citizens”. Please go to https://research.virginia.edu/covid-19-research-news. See in particular:
    Staff, Faculty Across Grounds Unite to 3-D Print, Create, Donate Critical Medical Supplies
    UVA Joins National Trial to Test Potential COVID-19 Medication
    The long game: UVA researchers shift focus to COVID-19
    UVA Health Independently Develops New COVID-19 Tests
    UVA researchers racing to develop COVID-19 vaccine and test
    UVA Health Offering COVID-19 Testing to Virginia Hospitals
    UVA researchers may have found faster way to detect COVID-19
    Biocomplexity Researchers Working With Health Officials to Predict Coronavirus’ Spread

    1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
      Reed Fawell 3rd

      Where are hard results? Where are the tests delivered. Best I can discern its been a very weak performance by UVA, one that started off very slow, and got no quicker, and needed to an outside private million dollar grant to get going. That does not strike me as the performance worthy of a first class research university, after all the money spent by taxpayers and students, and all the over the top bragging we’ve been hearing for the last decade. Be interesting to compare to University of Maryland, and Johns Hopkins, not to mention private firms that are actually efficient and competent and get things done, along with nurses and so many other low paid health workers working their tails off, solving real on the ground threats.

  11. djrippert Avatar
    djrippert

    500 possible / probable Abbott devices in Virginia * 3 tests per device per day = 1,500 more tests per day. Yesterday we ran 2,544 tests. By using the Abbott devices assumed to already exist in Virginia with the testing supplies currently being shipped by Abbott we could increase testing by just under 60%? Almost immediately?

    Is it possible that there are none of these Abbott devices already in the field in Virginia for some reason? If not, this represents perhaps the biggest state government COVID-19 blunder to date. And the Democrats want to expand this government through higher taxes? Seriously?

    1. Steve Haner Avatar
      Steve Haner

      https://www.abbott.com/corpnewsroom/product-and-innovation/detect-covid-19-in-as-little-as-5-minutes.html

      More on the testing module and the underlying machine, which as noted is hardly new and is bound to be used in various Virginia locations.

      “When not being used for COVID-19 testing, ID NOW is the leading molecular point-of-care platform for Influenza A&B, Strep A and respiratory syncytial virus (RSV) testing. Our platform holds the largest molecular point-of-care footprint in the U.S. and is already widely available in physicians’ offices, urgent care clinics, and hospital emergency departments across the country.”

      1. sherlockj Avatar
        sherlockj

        As importantly, it is portable. The ID NOW platform can easily be moved from individual urgent care centers or physicians offices to such places as nursing homes, long term care facilities, ERs or drive-thru test centers to test large numbers of the right folks and then returned to their owners. The people who operate them in their current locations can go with them and get paid. If the Northam administration does its job right, those are the kind of choices that will be made.

    2. Acbar Avatar
      Acbar

      Re: “already widely available in physicians’ offices, urgent care clinics, and hospital emergency departments across the country” — I believe I’ve seen one at my local doc-in-the-box clinic.

  12. djrippert Avatar
    djrippert

    500 possible / probable Abbott devices in Virginia * 3 tests per device per day = 1,500 more tests per day. Yesterday we ran 2,544 tests. By using the Abbott devices assumed to already exist in Virginia with the testing supplies currently being shipped by Abbott we could increase testing by just under 60%? Almost immediately?

    Is it possible that there are none of these Abbott devices already in the field in Virginia for some reason? If not, this represents perhaps the biggest state government COVID-19 blunder to date. And the Democrats want to expand this government through higher taxes? Seriously?

    1. Steve Haner Avatar
      Steve Haner

      https://www.abbott.com/corpnewsroom/product-and-innovation/detect-covid-19-in-as-little-as-5-minutes.html

      More on the testing module and the underlying machine, which as noted is hardly new and is bound to be used in various Virginia locations.

      “When not being used for COVID-19 testing, ID NOW is the leading molecular point-of-care platform for Influenza A&B, Strep A and respiratory syncytial virus (RSV) testing. Our platform holds the largest molecular point-of-care footprint in the U.S. and is already widely available in physicians’ offices, urgent care clinics, and hospital emergency departments across the country.”

    2. Acbar Avatar
      Acbar

      Re: “already widely available in physicians’ offices, urgent care clinics, and hospital emergency departments across the country” — I believe I’ve seen one at my local doc-in-the-box clinic.

  13. sherlockj Avatar
    sherlockj

    One other note. The CDC messed up in producing the first test. No question. The CDC is a black box of epidemiologist “experts”. No administration is staffed to pre-judge how they are going to handle anything. I hope that revisions to planning in the future take this into account, such as inviting top university and commercial research labs participate virtually in any crisis CDC R&D. The flip side of the coin of letting a thousand flowers grow is that there is quality control risk in letting multiple research labs produce and use their own tests simultaneously without FDA review under an Emergency Use Authorization. The FDA did their part of the job as far as I can tell, though faster is better if quality can be assured. Hard to judge. The CDC development failed initially. Welcome to science in a hurry.

    1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
      Reed Fawell 3rd

      All that is being done big time now by the Federal government best I can tell, after many years of neglect and failures to act, despite the fact they should have known better and did know according to some, again a bureaucratic problem rampant in American Government now.

  14. sherlockj Avatar
    sherlockj

    One other note. The CDC messed up in producing the first test. No question. The CDC is a black box of epidemiologist “experts”. No administration is staffed to pre-judge how they are going to handle anything. I hope that revisions to planning in the future take this into account, such as inviting top university and commercial research labs participate virtually in any crisis CDC R&D. The flip side of the coin of letting a thousand flowers grow is that there is quality control risk in letting multiple research labs produce and use their own tests simultaneously without FDA review under an Emergency Use Authorization. The FDA did their part of the job as far as I can tell, though faster is better if quality can be assured. Hard to judge. The CDC development failed initially. Welcome to science in a hurry.

    1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
      Reed Fawell 3rd

      All that is being done big time now by the Federal government best I can tell, after many years of neglect and failures to act, despite the fact they should have known better and did know according to some, again a bureaucratic problem rampant in American Government now.

  15. DeptOfTyranny Avatar
    DeptOfTyranny

    Based on comments in previous related posts, it seems to me that progressives would rather destroy the economy through mass quarantine, then let private enterprise provide mass testing to pin-point outbreaks for targeted quarantine.

    Government and its cronies might have a plan for yesterday’s crisis, but its bureaucracies and vested interests are too cumbersome to swiftly deal with the problems at hand. Meanwhile, private enterprise is doing everything it can to adapt and rise to the occasion (despite Richmond and Washington.)

    The fact that even the conservatives in this group are looking to government to know what’s happening in the trenches is rich!

    1. DeptOfTyranny Avatar
      DeptOfTyranny

      If there’s a place for government, it might be to develop a “crisis” logistics system or protocol that helps private enterprise openly coordinate; then get the heck out of the way. This might include relaxing patent restrictions, for example.

      We already have a robust system available, that uses the price signal to coordinate suppliers and consumers, if Herring et. al weren’t too busy virtual signaling to allow it to work.

      1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
        Reed Fawell 3rd

        “If there’s a place for government, it might be to develop a “crisis” logistics system or protocol that helps private enterprise openly coordinate; then get the heck out of the way.”

        Yes, I agree, and that also is being done now in revolutionary new ways, by highly competent private enterprise working cooperatively in league with a highly competent gov. agencies such as FEMA, Corps of Engineers, National Guard and slew of highly effective military personnel and units working alongside them and other government agencies. That is a big and grand story here, and many lessons learned and far better systems established to prevent this mess in future, at least on the Federal Level.

    2. LarrytheG Avatar
      LarrytheG

      re: ” Based on comments in previous related posts, it seems to me that progressives would rather destroy the economy through mass quarantine, then let private enterprise provide mass testing to pin-point outbreaks for targeted quarantine.”

      Well, I’ve been called a progressive (and other things here), but let me respond by giving an example. Say you have 10 people working in a restaurant – and they all tested negative… then two weeks later, a patron who is infected gets a meal and infects one of the employees but no one knows this. So that employee then infects other employees who in turn infect other restaurant patrons.

      Without repeated testing – to quickly find out that someone has been infected, it just runs wild.

      That’s what the lockdown is about to keep people from congregating because we have no way to quickly detect infections and isolate.

      If we’re going to re-open the economy, how would we do it – for that restaurant scenario?

      I’m not at all opposed to the private sector – ANY medical provider, pharmacies, doc-in-box, you name it – but the rub is the testing regime itself and how negative tests and new infections are detected and isolated.

      this is not a “progressive” thing either – look at this poll:

      Poll: 72 percent won’t go to games again without coronavirus vaccine

      United States sports leagues may be itching to return to action but 72 percent of those who responded to a Seton Hall poll said they would not feel safe to attend games until a vaccine for the novel coronavirus is developed.

      https://nypost.com/2020/04/09/poll-shows-sports-may-face-fan-fear-crisis-upon-coronavirus-return/

      I suspect that many of the 72% would also be leery of restaurants and other places where large groups of people congregate.

      Some think this is about government and it is but it’s also about how people feel and their fears, and most of them now seem to know the danger… and even if the govt says it’s “ok” – they’re not going to be assured unless they see a real plan to quickly identify the infected and get them isolated.

      There simply is no easy way to do this without a LOT of testing.

  16. DeptOfTyranny Avatar
    DeptOfTyranny

    Based on comments in previous related posts, it seems to me that progressives would rather destroy the economy through mass quarantine, then let private enterprise provide mass testing to pin-point outbreaks for targeted quarantine.

    Government and its cronies might have a plan for yesterday’s crisis, but its bureaucracies and vested interests are too cumbersome to swiftly deal with the problems at hand. Meanwhile, private enterprise is doing everything it can to adapt and rise to the occasion (despite Richmond and Washington.)

    The fact that even the conservatives in this group are looking to government to know what’s happening in the trenches is rich!

    1. DeptOfTyranny Avatar
      DeptOfTyranny

      If there’s a place for government, it might be to develop a “crisis” logistics system or protocol that helps private enterprise openly coordinate; then get the heck out of the way. This might include relaxing patent restrictions, for example.

      We already have a robust system available, that uses the price signal to coordinate suppliers and consumers, if Herring et. al weren’t too busy virtual signaling to allow it to work.

    2. LarrytheG Avatar
      LarrytheG

      re: ” Based on comments in previous related posts, it seems to me that progressives would rather destroy the economy through mass quarantine, then let private enterprise provide mass testing to pin-point outbreaks for targeted quarantine.”

      Well, I’ve been called a progressive (and other things here), but let me respond by giving an example. Say you have 10 people working in a restaurant – and they all tested negative… then two weeks later, a patron who is infected gets a meal and infects one of the employees but no one knows this. So that employee then infects other employees who in turn infect other restaurant patrons.

      Without repeated testing – to quickly find out that someone has been infected, it just runs wild.

      That’s what the lockdown is about to keep people from congregating because we have no way to quickly detect infections and isolate.

      If we’re going to re-open the economy, how would we do it – for that restaurant scenario?

      I’m not at all opposed to the private sector – ANY medical provider, pharmacies, doc-in-box, you name it – but the rub is the testing regime itself and how negative tests and new infections are detected and isolated.

      this is not a “progressive” thing either – look at this poll:

      Poll: 72 percent won’t go to games again without coronavirus vaccine

      United States sports leagues may be itching to return to action but 72 percent of those who responded to a Seton Hall poll said they would not feel safe to attend games until a vaccine for the novel coronavirus is developed.

      https://nypost.com/2020/04/09/poll-shows-sports-may-face-fan-fear-crisis-upon-coronavirus-return/

      I suspect that many of the 72% would also be leery of restaurants and other places where large groups of people congregate.

      Some think this is about government and it is but it’s also about how people feel and their fears, and most of them now seem to know the danger… and even if the govt says it’s “ok” – they’re not going to be assured unless they see a real plan to quickly identify the infected and get them isolated.

      There simply is no easy way to do this without a LOT of testing.

  17. LarrytheG Avatar
    LarrytheG

    It’s more than the test machines. You have to have the COVID19 test right?

    And the problem is what do you do with the test results ? Do they go into a database so that we know – say for an employer- that he/she can check on
    their employees to see who has been tested and shown negative?

    Beyond that – just because you test negative – does not mean you may not be infected the next day if you’re coming into contact with others.

    I see where Google and Apple are collaborating on using cell phones for contact tracing… apparently already being used in other countries?

    that could be part of the solution… but it does have risks – it looks like something you’d want to purge off your phone after this is over with.

    1. Acbar Avatar
      Acbar

      “the problem is what do you do with the test results ” — yes, I foresee this becoming a big issue since the current system is so haphazard and its own reporting regulations are poorly written and poorly enforced by the State.

      Contact tracing is a whole ‘nother can of worms from a privacy point of view. Whew!

      1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
        Reed Fawell 3rd

        “yes, I foresee this becoming a big issue since the current system is so haphazard and its own reporting regulations are poorly written and poorly enforced by the State.”

        Amen to that, Acbar. And as to Virginia, it’s exactly as Jim S. predicted here as far back as January as I recall.

  18. LarrytheG Avatar
    LarrytheG

    It’s more than the test machines. You have to have the COVID19 test right?

    And the problem is what do you do with the test results ? Do they go into a database so that we know – say for an employer- that he/she can check on
    their employees to see who has been tested and shown negative?

    Beyond that – just because you test negative – does not mean you may not be infected the next day if you’re coming into contact with others.

    I see where Google and Apple are collaborating on using cell phones for contact tracing… apparently already being used in other countries?

    that could be part of the solution… but it does have risks – it looks like something you’d want to purge off your phone after this is over with.

    1. Acbar Avatar
      Acbar

      “the problem is what do you do with the test results ” — yes, I foresee this becoming a big issue since the current system is so haphazard and its own reporting regulations are poorly written and poorly enforced by the State.

      Contact tracing is a whole ‘nother can of worms from a privacy point of view. Whew!

  19. LarryM Avatar
    LarryM

    Folks,
    I too have lamented the bungled early testing. But the Abbott test has been deployed at INOVA Fairfax based on my experience.
    I arrived around 1:00am, Tuesday 4/7/2020. Here are extracts from the hospital report system.
    “Test performed using the Abbott m2000 SARS-CoV-2 EUA Test.
    Collected on 04/07/2020 1:16 AM from Nasopharynx
    Resulted on 04/08/2020 10:35 AM”
    I can only speculate on the 24+ turnaround. Perhaps to test was run at INOVA, but delayed due to backups. Or maybe it was sent out and the delay is due to both transportation and commercial lab backlog.
    So, hope that Abbott and Roche ramp up to test millions.

  20. LarryM Avatar
    LarryM

    Folks,
    I too have lamented the bungled early testing. But the Abbott test has been deployed at INOVA Fairfax based on my experience.
    I arrived around 1:00am, Tuesday 4/7/2020. Here are extracts from the hospital report system.
    “Test performed using the Abbott m2000 SARS-CoV-2 EUA Test.
    Collected on 04/07/2020 1:16 AM from Nasopharynx
    Resulted on 04/08/2020 10:35 AM”
    I can only speculate on the 24+ turnaround. Perhaps to test was run at INOVA, but delayed due to backups. Or maybe it was sent out and the delay is due to both transportation and commercial lab backlog.
    So, hope that Abbott and Roche ramp up to test millions.

  21. LarrytheG Avatar
    LarrytheG

    I think Nancy_Naive is dead on correct.

    The statement was made that we cannot test 330 million people as if even if we did that, we’d only test each person one time, then no more.

    It does not work that way. Pandemics do not work that way. We’re going to need BILLIONS of tests – and we will have to test simultaneously – not “staged” across various cities unless we’re going to prevent people from traveling from a city not yet tested to other cities – carrying the infection to re-infect others already tested.

    Medical folks, first responders, who work directly with COVID19 patients have to be tested almost every day to make sure they did not contract the virus from those they cared for the previous day.

    The same would go for ANY person who has mingled with others, new ones every day – like a restaurant worker who would see new customers every day.

    You test them one day, and the next day they come into contact with new people who may be infected.. The last test is only good for as long as you do not come into contact with additional others.

    How many tests will be needed? Probably way more than 330 million and more importantly – as Nancy_Naive points out – how many per day do we need – across the country?

    Richmond and NoVa have to have testing simultaneously not NoVa first then Richmond unless we’re going to lock down Richmond from travelling outside of Richmond until we have testing in place for Richmond.

    This is way more complex and involved than what some folks are thinking.

    Anthony Fauci and many other epidemiologists are saying just this – that “more testing” – is a LOT more than just testing a few people – one time.

    Testing will have to be done continuously – in concert with contact tracing. Every time we find someone who is infected, we have to then go find and test whoever they had contact with. Any of that group that tests positive, we need to go test their contacts, so forth and so on.

  22. Nancy_Naive Avatar
    Nancy_Naive

    50,000 of the coronavirus test kits manufactured per day.

    Okay, that means we can meaningfully test one major city in Virginia per day. Or, New York, LA, and San Francisco can use the first two year’s production.

    Then, we can test cities alphabetically. Will Richmond wait until 2028, or will it just call itself AAARichmond?

  23. Nancy_Naive Avatar
    Nancy_Naive

    50,000 of the coronavirus test kits manufactured per day.

    Okay, that means we can meaningfully test one major city in Virginia per day. Or, New York, LA, and San Francisco can use the first two year’s production.

    Then, we can test cities alphabetically. Will Richmond wait until 2028, or will it just call itself AAARichmond?

  24. LarrytheG Avatar
    LarrytheG

    I think Nancy_Naive is dead on correct.

    The statement was made that we cannot test 330 million people as if even if we did that, we’d only test each person one time, then no more.

    It does not work that way. Pandemics do not work that way. We’re going to need BILLIONS of tests – and we will have to test simultaneously – not “staged” across various cities unless we’re going to prevent people from traveling from a city not yet tested to other cities – carrying the infection to re-infect others already tested.

    Medical folks, first responders, who work directly with COVID19 patients have to be tested almost every day to make sure they did not contract the virus from those they cared for the previous day.

    The same would go for ANY person who has mingled with others, new ones every day – like a restaurant worker who would see new customers every day.

    You test them one day, and the next day they come into contact with new people who may be infected.. The last test is only good for as long as you do not come into contact with additional others.

    How many tests will be needed? Probably way more than 330 million and more importantly – as Nancy_Naive points out – how many per day do we need – across the country?

    Richmond and NoVa have to have testing simultaneously not NoVa first then Richmond unless we’re going to lock down Richmond from travelling outside of Richmond until we have testing in place for Richmond.

    This is way more complex and involved than what some folks are thinking.

    Anthony Fauci and many other epidemiologists are saying just this – that “more testing” – is a LOT more than just testing a few people – one time.

    Testing will have to be done continuously – in concert with contact tracing. Every time we find someone who is infected, we have to then go find and test whoever they had contact with. Any of that group that tests positive, we need to go test their contacts, so forth and so on.

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