by James A. Bacon

Matan Goldstein is a rarity at the University of Virginia — a Jewish student unafraid to openly defend Israel in its war with Hamas and oppose Students for Justice in Palestine (SJP), a pro-Palestinian group that praised Hamas’ October 7 terror attacks on Israeli citizens. The Israeli student has appeared on local talk radio and published an op-ed in the local newspaper. He wears a kippah, openly identifying himself as a Jew, and he was one of the two students who waved an Israeli flag on the steps of the Rotunda during an SJP rally. 

Goldstein, who was drawn to UVa by its classics program, was surprised upon coming to Charlottesville by the prevalence of antisemitism and the impotent handwringing of the UVa administration in dealing with it. University officials have declined to criticize the eliminationist rhetoric of pro-Palestinian students and faculty. Instead, the University has created a religious diversity task force to investigate discrimination against Jews… and Muslims… and other religions. Two of the eleven task-force members had signed a faculty letter faulting Ryan for his failure to sufficiently acknowledge the suffering of the Palestinians.

Goldstein’s account is echoed by other members of UVa’s Jewish community contacted by The Jefferson Council, although he was the only one willing to speak on the record. A law school student spoke off the record, while parents, alumni, a professor and a rabbi conveyed the sentiments of many other Jewish students whom I was unable to contact for first-hand accounts. Jewish students are so reticent to speak publicly that the signatories to a letter in The Cavalier Daily identified themselves only as “a group of Jewish students.”

During his first-year orientation in September, Goldstein participated in a group discussion in which students told others about themselves. He mentioned that he was Israeli. A classmate, a student from Egypt, spoke up. He said he was angry at the Jewish state and the Israeli Defense Force. He thought Abdul Gamal Nasser, an Egyptian dictator who sought to destroy Israel in the Six Day War, was a hero. “He said we could never be friends.”

Anti-Israeli animus intensified after October 7. The UVa chapter of the Students for Justice in Palestine (SJP) endorsed the Hamas actions (without referring to the slaughter of 1,200 women, children, grandmothers, babies and other civilians) on the grounds that Israelis oppressed Palestinians and that liberation “by any means necessary” was called for. The SJP organized two rallies near the Rotunda, waved Palestinian flags, and chanted, “Palestine will be free from the river to the sea,” which, in light of the recent massacres, Goldstein viewed as a call for the eradication of the Israeli state and dispossession or murder of its seven million Jewish citizens.

President Jim Ryan issued a statement denouncing the Hamas terror attacks, but he pointedly has not criticized SJP for contributing to the hostile environment for Jews at UVa. Unhappy with Ryan’s neutrality, 80 UVa professors signed a letter declaring themselves “unsettled” by his failure to recognize the sufferings of the Palestinians and calling for the October 7 horrors to be viewed “in context.”

Flier promoting the “Teach-in on Palestine.” Note the use of the University of Virginia logo in the top left-hand corner, by which event organizers imply endorsement of the event by the University administration. University marks are registered trademarks and may only be reproduced with permission.

That letter was followed by a “teach in” on the Grounds marked by inflammatory anti-Israel rhetoric.

“They called my country a colonial entity that had enslaved Palestine for 75 years,” Goldstein says. They described Jews “as colonizers and committers of genocide.” The outrage about civilian casualties in Gaza, he observes, vividly contrasts with the total disinterest in the hundreds of thousands of civilians killed in civil wars in Syria, Libya, Yemen and Sudan, he observes. “It’s just Jew hatred at this point.”

Other than getting shoved by SJP marchers when he was displaying the Israeli flag, he has not experienced any physical violence, Goldstein says. None of my other sources attested to violence or threats of violence at UVa either, but incidents on other campuses combined with the prevailing rhetoric on Grounds leave many Jewish students uneasy.

Schlomo Mayer, rabbi of the Chabad House, interacts with Jewish students during meals and Bible study. “Some are discouraged,” he says. “Some say they are afraid to leave their house.”

Pro-Palestinians say they are anti-Zionists opposing the Jewish state, not Jews generally, but Goldstein says anti-Zionism often spills over into antisemitism. People frequently flash their middle fingers at him. When he was lunching with a professor one day, someone passed by and shouted, “Free Palestine, you filthy Jew!”

Nothing much can be done about such invective. Goldstein didn’t know the student, he says, so he couldn’t report him.

However, a law school student cites a case in which the identity of the student is known. Jewish law school students put up posters bearing the images of some hostages held by Hamas to raise money for their families. A pro-Palestinian law student tore the posters down. Student Affairs did track down the perpetrator and did inform him or her that tearing down posters violated the student code of conduct. The student gave assurances that he or she would not repeat the offense. However, as far as the law student knows, the individual was never punished.

The mood at UVa is ugly, the law student says. “You have a significant anti-Israel narrative supported by students and faculties, and embedded in that narrative is a willingness to kill innocent Jews.”

Consider the SJP rallies at UVa. The pro-Palestinian group promoted the first anti-Israel rally with a poster showing a bulldozer knocking down the border fence between Gaza and Israel, allowing Gaza fighters to pour through and attack nearby Israeli settlements. SJP issued a statement declaring its unequivocal support for Palestinian liberation “by whatever means necessary.” During its rallies, SJP supporters masked their faces, reminiscent of the face-covering keffiyehs worn by terrorist killers. At one rally, a demonstrator wore a rat costume emblazoned with a yellow Star of David.

Robert Parham, an Iranian-born Jew who fled Iran and settled in Israel before coming to the United States as a professor at the McIntire school, says that Jewish students and parents started contacting him after the massacres in Israel. One student told him other students came into his dormitory room and threatened him. Another said she doesn’t feel safe going to class. A third wanted to attend a pro-Israeli counterdemonstration but was afraid for her safety and didn’t want to go by herself, he says.

“UVA has become an unsafe place for Jewish students both in and out of the classroom,” says a letter addressed to Ryan and signed by 300 Jewish alumni, parents and friends. There have been blatant breaches of UVa’s student code of conduct, the letter declared. “Our students are hurting. They are isolated, anxious, and emotionally affected…. It has been quite difficult to study and engage when antisemitism is pervasive … in classrooms, at the Rotunda, and in friendship circles. Some professors are excusing students from class for walkouts, to go to rallies, and offering extra credit for attending them. Other professors are having their entire class attend these hate-based rallies, while others are utilizing their own platforms to encourage participation.”

The professors releasing their students from class did so in direct violation of an order from the provost not to. None have been reprimanded, at least not publicly.

What has been Ryan’s response? He has met with a number of Jews in the UVa community and professed concern for all who suffer from the Israeli-Hamas conflict. Answering the parents’ letter, he said that threatening physical harm is impermissible, and antisemitic statements or statements in support of terrorism are “deplorable.” But he declined to take sides in the controversy between Palestinians and Jews at UVa.

Issuing statements about current events was a “very slippery slope,” he explained. “To start down the road of condemning specific statements that contravene our values, as tempting as it is at times, is to start down a road that is endless. Before you know it you are the arbiter of debates about the morality of all sorts of statements.”

Free speech isn’t easy, Ryan concluded.

Neither is being a Jew at UVa these days.

James A. Bacon is executive director of The Jefferson Council. This article is republished with permission from the Jefferson Council blog.


Share this article



ADVERTISEMENT

(comments below)



ADVERTISEMENT

(comments below)


Comments

57 responses to “A Hostile Environment for Jews”

  1. William O'Keefe Avatar
    William O’Keefe

    The environment at UVA has to reflect the values of its leadership and Board. Putting out memos about free speech and tolerance means little unless the President enforces it.
    A university should be an environment where free speech and debate is encouraged in a healthy and academic manner. According town opinion piece in today’s RTD, VMI has instituted a program to foster that. UVA should do something similar and the President should make clear the distinction between debate to learn and debate to harass. The consequence of the latter should be expulsion.
    Change the incentives to get different behavior. It shouldn’t be that difficult.

    1. Dick Hall-Sizemore Avatar
      Dick Hall-Sizemore

      Please define the difference between “debate to learn” and “debate to harrass.” At what point would debating to learn slip into the area leading to expulsion?

      1. William O'Keefe Avatar
        William O’Keefe

        The difference is one where the debate to learn involves exchanging ideas, seeking information, and understanding the other person’s perspective. Debating to harass is attacking verbally to score points or to be threatening.
        I refer you to a 2013 WSJ opinion piece by the president of Notre Dame, John Jenkins. It is titled Persuasion as the Cure for Incivility:What if, instead of demonizing opponents, we took steps to persuade them. It is still available on the web and expresses my views clearly.

        1. Dick Hall-Sizemore Avatar
          Dick Hall-Sizemore

          I agree with you on the need for civil debate in which one does not demonize one’s opponents. I wonder how much of that we will see in the coming year.

          I don’t agree that “attacking verbally to score points” should be grounds for expulsion.

          1. Even racial epithets?

          2. Eric the half a troll Avatar
            Eric the half a troll

            My opinion, fwiw, is no. I think people can and should be publicly exposed and shamed for such behavior but not expelled. Don’t care if they find themselves unemployable as a result either.

          3. William O'Keefe Avatar
            William O’Keefe

            You have misinterpreted my comment Dick. I qualified my comment by stating harassing and to threaten. We probably actually agree on where to draw the line but I favor creating an incentive that strongly discourages the kind of threatening and harassing actions being reported there.

  2. Donald Smith Avatar
    Donald Smith

    The Jewish community at UVa should announce that it plans to have an “I Stand With Israel” rally on the Rotunda steps. If they’ve already had one, they need to have several more. President Ryan should attend, he should speak, and loudly and passionately denounce the pro-Hamas crowd.

    There should also be plenty of cops. Lots and lots of cops. With itchy arrest fingers. (This IS Charlottesville, though. I suspect anyone that gets arrested will be immediately released.) But, it should lift the spirits of the UVA Jewish community to see some Hamas supporters in handcuffs, being dragged/carried into police vans. Especially if President Ryan warns that he will do everything in his power to expel students who threaten the peace at UVA.

    Having said that, not everyone who attends these Hamas-friendly rallies is a Hamas supporter or an endorser of the Al-Aqsa Flood (October 7). I’m confident that hardly any of the attendees at those rallies endorsed the barbaric behavior of Hamas thugs on October 7th. The pro-Palestinian community is going to have to figure out how to separate itself publicly from the pro-Hamas fringe.

    1. Dick Hall-Sizemore Avatar
      Dick Hall-Sizemore

      I agree with your first two sentences.

      1. Donald Smith Avatar
        Donald Smith

        Ummm…OK, I guess. If you’d like to explain why you can’t agree with the rest of what I said, feel free to tell us why. But I’m not going to play games with you. If you have something to say, say it.

    2. beachguy Avatar

      **The Jewish community at UVa should announce that it plans to have an “I Stand With Israel” rally**
      I agree! That is long overdue.

    3. Matan Goldstein organized a counter-rally of 30 students. When push came to shove, 10 dropped out at the last minute — they were too frightened to take part. Whether their fears of retaliation are justified or not, most pro-Israel Jewish students are keeping their heads down.

      UVa has created, to borrow a phrase from the DEI lexicon, a “hostile environment” for Jews. I expect the Palestinians will claim that Islamophobia occurs at UVa as well as antisemitism. And maybe it does to some degree. But it doesn’t stop students from attending pro-Palestinian rallies in very large numbers.

    4. Matan Goldstein organized a counter-rally of 30 students. When push came to shove, 10 dropped out at the last minute — they were too frightened to take part. Whether their fears of retaliation are justified or not, most pro-Israel Jewish students are keeping their heads down.

      UVa has created, to borrow a phrase from the DEI lexicon, a “hostile environment” for Jews. I expect the Palestinians will claim that Islamophobia occurs at UVa as well as antisemitism. And maybe it does to some degree. But it doesn’t stop students from attending pro-Palestinian rallies in very large numbers.

      1. Donald Smith Avatar
        Donald Smith

        Jim, what support is the Jewish student contingent at UVa looking for? Sanctions against the Hamas supporters? A stronger police presence at pro-Israel rallies?

      2. Lefty665 Avatar

        most pro-Israel Jewish students are keeping their heads down.”

        As well they should. Standing up for Israeli war crimes and crimes against humanity is, politely, cringe worthy. As religious people we could hope they would have higher standards and be able to hold their heads up.

        1. f/k/a_tmtfairfax Avatar
          f/k/a_tmtfairfax

          How do you address Hamas’ violations of international law by locating military facilities in residential and hospital areas? I’m not arguing that every single action of the IDF has been reasonable and lawful under international law but using hospitals and residential areas as cover while attacking Israel simply is not lawful. Hamas has invited Palestinian deaths.

          Hamas is dedicated to the elimination of Jews as much as the Nazis were. Hamas must be removed. What I find missing are calls from Palestinian religious leaders for the elimination of Hamas rule over Gaza and the turning over of Hamas members to the United Nations as part of a broad ceasefire. Maybe I missed that but maybe not.

          1. Lefty665 Avatar

            You will not find anywhere that I have defended Hamas because I have not. I cannot do anything about Hamas. I can however, remark on and advocate against, the crimes against humanity committed by our ally, Israel, to whom the US has given and is continuing to give unconditional support.

            That support includes more than 5,000 1 ton bombs that we have recently supplied Israel and which they have used on densely populated areas, including refugee camps. That is a war crime.

            International law specifically addresses the mixing of civilian and military. While acknowledging that makes things harder for combatants it explicitly requires them to protect civilians from harm. Arguing that Hamas uses civilians as shields as Israel does is not a defense that allows war crimes, the murder of civilians.

            We can tell the good guys from the bad guys by their actions. The bad guys are Hamas for using human shields, Israel for killing the shields to get at Hamas, and us for supporting Israeli war crimes. You can tell who the good guys are because they are dead. That is not likely much consolation to the good guys.

            Israel is cannot completely eliminate Hamas. Worse yet its murder of Palestinian civilians and devastation of Gaza has united much of the world, and all of the Muslim world (more than a billion people), against Israel,and us because of our unqualified support of Israel.

            Paybacks are likely to be a bitch, and 8M Israelis against 1+B Moslems are not good odds. Remember too that 911 was in part because of our support of Israeli attacks on refugee camps in Lebanon. We are not likely to get off free either.

            Perhaps what you missed is that the US vetoed a UN resolution calling for a cease fire, so it doesn’t matter what the Palestinians would or would not advocate. The US ensured it would not happen and that Israeli crimes against humanity would continue, and they have.

        2. The IDF should have reacted with proportionality —– raping Gaza women, burning Gaza babies, and taking hundreds of hostages.

          1. Lefty665 Avatar

            Among the worst mistakes we can make is believing our own propaganda. The taking of hostages part is true, and reprehensible, but the other is made up to enflame emotions and justify war crimes.

            It now appears that half or more of the Israeli deaths on 10/7 were murdered by the panicked, kill everything that moves IDF.

            Hamas did not have weapons that could burn bodies beyond recognition. Israel did, and has admitted using them indiscriminately.

            Where is the outrage over Israel killing its own?

        3. All deaths in a war are not war crimes. Where is your outrage against Russian actions in Ukraine that were clearly war crimes?

          1. Lefty665 Avatar

            In 3 months of war the Israeli’s have killed more than 20 times as many civilians as the Russians have in nearly 2 years of war, a war instigated by the US on Russia’s border.

            Among the worst mistakes we can make is believing our own, or in this case, our toady Zelenski’s, propaganda.

            Surely Russian troops have committed war crimes. All armies do, and all should be prosecuted, including Russian, Ukrainian and Israeli.

            However, the high profile accusations in Ukraine have been clearly demonstrated to be Ukrainian propaganda.

            Two examples:

            1) The serial number of the train station missile showed it had been transferred to Ukraine, and its trajectory led back to a Ukrainian missile unit.

            2) The bodies in Bucha did not show up in the streets until 5 days after the Russians pulled out on Wednesday and the Ukrainian Nazi Azov battalion moved in. The NYT did report and photograph in Bucha on Saturday showing Azov troops but curiously no bodies. They showed up in the streets the next day, Sunday discovered by people on their way to church.

            Ukrainian propaganda of Russians killing civilians is much like the accusations of Hamas beheading and baking babies in ovens are Israeli propaganda.

            Believing propaganda that is designed to inflame emotions leads us to bad ends. Often times in support of the very perpetrators as it is designed to do. Reagan observation to trust but verify was good advice.

          2. Or Ukraine’s attacks on Russian civilian targets? The USMIL and White House are not micro-managing Z-man’s war efforts.

  3. Dick Hall-Sizemore Avatar
    Dick Hall-Sizemore

    “None of my other sources attested to violence or threats of violence at UVa either.”

    This is a key statement that seems to have been lost in the whole discussion.

    1. Yes, it’s important to note that the threatening behavior reported in some northeastern universities has not occurred at UVa. But you don’t need physical violence or even threats of violence to create a “hostile environment.”

    2. Yes, it’s important to note that the threatening behavior reported in some northeastern universities has not occurred at UVa. But you don’t need physical violence or even threats of violence to create a “hostile environment.”

      1. Lefty665 Avatar

        Is it like some other issues, strictly the perception of the one feeling wronged?

  4. Turbocohen Avatar
    Turbocohen

    It’s amazing how Democrat SJP is.. or is it the other way around?

  5. Turbocohen Avatar
    Turbocohen

    It’s amazing how Democrat SJP is.. or is it the other way around?

  6. Nelson Fegley Avatar
    Nelson Fegley

    To keep this in perspective, I note that FIRE (Foundation for Individual Rights and Expression, headed by Greg Lukianoff) has rated UVa very highly for freedom of expression. I think it was rated 6 out of 248 schools polled. Students were polled directly in generating the results.

    Va Tech was rated 160 (below average), U of Penn 247, and Harvard 248 (dead last). I was guessing that having very strong Humanities and Political science departments helped produce the good result for UVa. I haven’t a clue as to what is going on at Tech, where I got a BSME in 1962.

    Even with the current issues noted at UVa, compared to many other academic communities it is doing pretty well.

    1. walter smith Avatar
      walter smith

      No, that does not reveal that UVA has a true free speech environment. It reveals how awful the state of free speech is everywhere.
      UVA gets a lot of credit for its so called free speech statement. The entire process has been shielded from the public as exempt from FOIA, even though UVA claims its support for “free expression” and “free inquiry” is “unequivocal.”
      Again, talk is cheap, and for UVA it is all talk.
      Did ONE professor at UVA object to (1) mask mandates, (2) lockdowns, (3) covid “vax” mandates, (4) denial of religious exemptions to students and employees at the school founded by the author of the religious liberty statute, (5) virtual teaching, (6) all of the lawfare, in all of its various formulations, against Trump with all norms broken, (7) the political persecution of J6ers (while Antifa mobs and Hunter Biden and now Sam Bankman Fried walk), (8) the compelled speech of mandated DEI statements?
      95% of UVA employee political contributions in federal elections go to Democrats. That is intentional policy of the Ryan admin and a failure of the BOV. The 5% not contributing to Dems are all likely Never Trumpers, moderate Republican types and know standing up for civil rights or anything perceived as pro-Trump is an academic death sentence.

      UVA and all of academia is infected with a poison. DEI = Gramscian Marxism and the results of which are the exact opposite of what the initials supposedly stand for…ON PURPOSE!

      All of these acronyms need to be abolished – SEL, CRT, ESG, DEI along with “climate change” and “sustainability.”

      UVA needs to get back to education. BOV – WAKE UP! Require SATs. Abolish DEI at every school and every department and anywhere it is then hidden – fire the Dean and department head.

  7. Eric the half a troll Avatar
    Eric the half a troll

    Interested in what, exactly, you think Ryan should do differently?

  8. Nancy Naive Avatar
    Nancy Naive

    ‘Tween…
    This will come to a fast end next week. Preoccupation ‘tween football and basketball. Throw in frat parties and the kids and faculty will slip back into ‘higher education’ mode.

    Besides, it’s winding down in Gaza. The Israelis surpassed the requisite 10:1 kill ratio a couple of weeks ago.

    1. Yeah, I reported on that a month ago. It’s a great way to duck responsibility for making hard moral choices Ryan has decided he does not want to make.

      It’s worth noting that when UVa’s free speech committee was deliberating about its free speech statement a year or two ago, one member suggested that it adopt the Kalven Committee principles as part of the free-speech statement. The Committee declined. Of course, back then, Ryan wasn’t facing the kind of pressure he’s facing now. We don’t know if Ryan weighed in on that issue because, of course, UVa has denied our FOIA request for internal Committee communications.

      1. LarrytheG Avatar
        LarrytheG

        In voicing such things… is it to be interpreted as the view of Ryan or UVA?

      2. Nancy Naive Avatar
        Nancy Naive

        One must never let their morals stand in the way of doing the right thing.

  9. beachguy Avatar

    This is very troubling. It would seem that a lot of people are ignoring the obvious and are willing to to look the other way. Free speech, as of late, seems to be more free for some groups rather than others.

  10. Dick Hall-Sizemore Avatar
    Dick Hall-Sizemore

    “Unhappy with Ryan’s neutrality, 80 UVa professors signed a letter declaring themselves “unsettled” by his failure to recognize the
    sufferings of the Palestinians and calling for the October 7 horrors to be viewed in ‘context.’”

    Bacon: “But he declined to take sides in the controversy between Palestinians and Jews at UVa.”

    It seems that both sides are unhappy with Ryan.

    1. That’s true. Ryan is getting pressure from both sides.

  11. Nancy Naive Avatar
    Nancy Naive

    Hey! This is America! When the Protestants and Catholics were bombing each other in Ireland, come March 17th it didn’t matter whether you traced your ancestors to Ulster or the Short Strand, you drank green beer and sang “My Wild Irish Rose”.

    We Are America!

    It’s our job to pick a day, preferably in February, when we can festoon our bars in red, black, and baby blue, and serve buckets of arak and hold parades.

  12. DJRippert Avatar
    DJRippert

    When 1 in 5 Americans aged 18-29 have a positive view of Osama Bin Laden, what do you expect?

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12890583/americans-osama-bin-laden-poll-gen-zers.html

    1. Nancy Naive Avatar
      Nancy Naive

      1 in 3 Republicans have a positive view of Donald Trump. That’s what I expect.

  13. Lefty665 Avatar

    Support for Israel’s war crimes and crimes against humanity are legitimate issues for vigorous criticism, just as was the German peoples support for Nazis.

    Those who conflate criticism of Israel with criticism of Jews are trying to suppress free speech as antisemitism. This quote from Goldstein is illustrative. It is reminiscent of Orwell:

    “They called my country a colonial entity that had enslaved Palestine
    for 75 years,” Goldstein says. They described Jews “as colonizers and
    committers of genocide.”

    The facile segue from criticism of Israel to all Jews is most charitably wrong. That the crimes against humanity in Gaza are committed mostly by Jews is a fact. However, the issue is the conduct, crimes against humanity, of the nation of Israel, facilitated by the USG, not the religion of most Israelis. That includes the murder more than 20,000 civilians, of whom more than 9,000 were children. That conduct is not supported by all Jews either in Israel or the US.

    1. Nancy Naive Avatar
      Nancy Naive

      Squatters. Don’t forget the West Bank squatters.

      1. Lefty665 Avatar

        Them too.

    2. It is fair to note that anti-Zionism is not the same as antisemitism. One can, in theory, be one without being the other. However, there is a lot of spillover.

      1. Lefty665 Avatar

        That is especially true when Jews support Israel’s crimes against humanity then cast criticism of that support as antisemitism and complain that criticism creates a hostile environment.

        People fleeing European failure to separate religion from state made up a big portion of our founders. That is why prohibiting state establishment of religion is in the 1st Amendment. Israel would have done well to emulate our separation of religion and state.

        Jews who embrace and support the criminal actions of the state of Israel because of their religion are on the wrong side of the founding principles of our country and the Bill of Rights. To then complain that criticism of their behavior makes them fearful and to characterize it as antisemitism doubles down on antiamericanism.

        It is long past time for knee jerk support of everything Israel does out of fear of being accused of antisemitism to cease.

        Remember the USS Liberty and Israeli murder of American sailors and spooks. Israel treated us no better than they do Palestinians. Is it because we’re all goyim? Insult to injury they used American supplied weapons and US taxpayer supplied money to kill our servicemen.

        Remember too Israeli spy Jonathan Pollard and the heroes welcome Netanyahoo gave him. It was paid for in part with $billions in annual American taxpayer financial support when we let him out of jail to return to his homeland, Israel.

        Israel does not have America’s best interests at heart. Why do we blindly support Israel?

        1. Fighting Hamas and others who violate the international conventions does not make Israel guilty of crimes against humanity.

          Israel exists as a homeland for Jews after a history of expulsions and no safe place to go–even the US in 1939. https://www.history.com/news/wwii-jewish-refugee-ship-st-louis-1939

          1. Lefty665 Avatar

            “Fighting Hamas and others who violate the international conventions does not make Israel guilty of crimes against humanity.”

            That is very true. If that was all that was happening in Gaza it would be far different. I certainly would not object to that. But that is not what is going on.

            What has happened is the murder of more than 20,000 Palestinian civilians, most of them women, old folks and more than 9,000 of them children. That is what makes Israel guilty of crimes against humanity. In addition, the bombing of refugee camps, hospitals, schools, churches and mosques as well as ambulances also qualify as war crimes.

            Dropping 2,000 pound bombs on densely populated areas like refugee camps that kills everything for blocks to get at tunnels are crimes against humanity. The US has supplied more than 5,400 of those bombs to Israel. That alone makes us accessories to war crimes.

            For Israel’s sake as well as our own we need to stop the Israeli war criminals crimes against humanity. It is not ok just because the Nazis did it to Jews first.

    3. Remember the Gazans voted Hamas into power, thus giving it their support.

      1. Lefty665 Avatar

        Remember too that Israel created Hamas as an alternative to the PLO. They also gave Hamas their support. That does not tar all Jews any more than all Gazans.

        1. So you acknowledge that Hamas and PA are one and the same….. if only others did the same.

          1. Lefty665 Avatar

            No, that was not what I said at all. You need to read more carefully. What I said was that Hamas was an Israeli creation. They invented it to oppose the PLO. That is hardly “Hamas and PA are one and the same” as you put it. Nor is the Palestinian Authority the same as the Palestinian Liberalization Organization.

        2. Israel did not create Hamas.

          1. Lefty665 Avatar

            You are right.

            Israel has embraced Hamas, has financed it (sometimes through other arab countries) and supported it as an alternative to the PLO.

            Here’s a Times of Israel article on Netanyahoo’s support of and advocacy for Hamas.

            https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/

            Sorry for my sloppy shorthand that incorrectly conflated founding with support and Israel’s use of Hamas as a counter to the PLO.

Leave a Reply