Demanding Truth from Those in Power

Terry McAuliffe speaking to CBS News. Who’s telling the truth — the governor or the state police spokesperson?

The national media rightfully calls out President Trump for making outrageous statements such as his infamous line that there were “some very fine people on both sides” of the deadly confrontation in Charlottesville Saturday. Really?

I know that there were some “very fine” people among the peaceful counter-protesters in Charlottesville — one, a gentle and peaceful woman, was a friend who conducted my daughter’s wedding ceremony and also led a family prayer wishing me a speedy recovery from my hip replacement surgery. (If there is a God, it appears that the Big Guy listened. My recovery is going splendidly.) Would the president care to enumerate the “very fine” people among the Nazis, Klansmen and affiliated white supremacists who traveled from around the country to participate in an event designed to stir up trouble? He can’t name any. He deserves the lambasting he’s received for making such a statement.

The question here in the Old Dominion is, will Virginia’s media call out Governor Terry McAuliffe for making unsubstantiated (though less emotionally charged) statements, the likes of which, had they issued from the mouth of Donald Trump, would be branded immediately as lies?

C.J. Ciaramella with the Reason Foundation’s  Hit & Run blog writes the following:

In an interview Monday on the Pod Save the People podcast, hosted by Black Lives Matter activist DeRay Mckesson, McAuliffe claimed the white nationalists who streamed into Charlottesville that weekend hid weapons throughout the town.

“They had battering rams and we had picked up different weapons that they had stashed around the city,” McAuliffe told Mckesson.

The Virginia State Police also disputed McAuliffe’s claims that Virginia State Police were underequipped to deal with the heavily armed militia members at Saturday’s rally.

“The governor was referencing the weapons and tactical gear the members of various groups attending the rally had on their persons,” Geller says. “I can assure you that the Virginia State Police personnel were equipped with more-than-adequate specialized tactical and protective gear for the purpose of fulfilling their duties to serve and protect those in attendance of the August 12 event in Charlottesville.”

McAuliffe claimed in an interview with The New York Times that law enforcement arrived to find a line of militia members who “had better equipment than our State Police had.” In longer comments that were later edited out of the Times‘ story, McAuliffe said that up to 80 percent of the rally attendees were carrying semi-automatic weapons. “You saw the militia walking down the street, you would have thought they were an army,” he said.

That’s Ciaramella’s framing of the issue. The Reason Foundation, a Libertarian organization, is a credible group and certainly no apologist for Nazis and Klansmen or their white-identity politics. Assuming this is a fair summary of the facts, someone needs to dig to the bottom of these conflicting statements. Who gave the accurate accounting — McAuliffe or the Virginia State Police spokesperson? If McAuliffe misspoke, will anyone call him on it?

These questions are part of a larger issue that Virginia’s media have been tip-toeing around. Did the Charlottesville police and State Police bungle the handling of the Saturday demonstration? According to some reports, when clearing the demonstration area at McIntire Park, the police herded the white supremacists into close proximity to the counter-protesters, and that’s when the worst melees broke out. Of course, anyone can claim anything. But do we have a clear idea from authoritative sources what did happen? Do we know who made the command decisions? I’ve seen a lot of ass-covering statements, but no systematic sorting of the facts. Are Virginia’s media interested in finding out, or are they satisfied with the narrative concocted by the national media? 

Here’s one reason people will want answers in the future, even if they are not clamoring for them right now. The Alt Right is developing a line of argumentation that James Allen Fields, driver of the car that killed Heather Heyer, undoubtedly will adopt in his defense. Fields, they say, was driving around disoriented in a strange town when he was set upon by Lefties. He accelerated his car to escape them, accidentally plowing into the crowd, put on his brakes when he realized what was happening. Within seconds (and this is viewable on videotape), armed counter-protesters swarmed the vehicle, struck the car with sticks and clubs, and bashed in the rear window. Panicking, Fields threw the car into reverse, toppling attackers like bowling pins.

Please note, I am not making this argument, I’m not excusing Fields, I’m not blaming the counter-protesters, and I’m not engaging in moral equivalency. I’m noting arguments circulated on the Internet that will likely preview Field’s defense. In what is shaping up to be Charlottesville’s trial of the century, Field’s attorneys assuredly will try to shift the blame to others. Besides blaming the counter-protesters, they will blame city and state authorities for making the decisions that unleashed the chaos and precipitated the chain of events leading to the car killing.

It won’t help the cause of justice if McAuliffe is caught making stuff up.

In closing, let me reiterate that I’m not defending white supremacists. Nazis are evil. Klansmen are evil. White supremacists are evil. They picked Charlottesville, Charlottesville didn’t pick them. They spewed hatred and vitriol. They came prepared for violence, and they dished it out. They deserve the full punishment of the law. I wish they had never come to Virginia, and I hope they all go home and never come back. But McAuliffe, who didn’t have a credibility problem before, might have one now.


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21 responses to “Demanding Truth from Those in Power”

  1. LarrytheG Avatar
    LarrytheG

    ” Please note, I am not making this argument, I’m not excusing Fields, I’m not blaming the counter-protesters, and I’m not engaging in moral equivalency. I’m noting arguments circulated on the Internet that will likely preview Field’s defense”

    It’s going to be a tough row to hoe when Fields is in many pictures standing next to other white supremacists PRIOR to driving that auto…

    In terms of McAuliffe .. trying to find news account that is NOT in publications like Brietbart, or Daily Caller or The Free Beacon.. I’d settle for the RTD or WSJ… etc….. but what I’m seeing is that the state police are referencing a briefing he received.. and it sounds like the SP WERE worried about an influx of weapons.. and the GOv may well have gone over the line… but there is no question there were a lot of weapons .. and the State Police worried about not only the ones they could see but potentially others they had not found or seen.

    I think this goes to show that you can’t discount this at all because it’s common knowledge that the right.. the KKK.. neo-nazis .. have a lot of weaponry and boast that they do.. and put it on display ..

    I have no doubt that some on the left may also have and/or be stocking up on weapons.. and if those don’t pucker your backside .. no matter whether you lean left or right.. – you need your head examined.. because if both sides show up in the future ready to battle.. the idea that the State police might be “outgunned” is not out of the realm of possible at all..

    If a thousand folks show up with weapons and shooting breaks out .. how many police will it take to deal with it – and what is the probability that a lot of folks are going to be shot -including police?

    We’re going to end up looking like some lawless 3rd world country with militia roaming the streets and controlling some places if we are not careful.

    1. TooManyTaxes Avatar
      TooManyTaxes

      Larry – what you forget is that the MSM regularly censors stories that are inconsistent with their position on issues. Do an Internet search today on McAuliffe and “gun cache.” I did and didn’t find any references from traditional news sources. The story is being spiked.

      The Post did a story today about McAuliffe’s change in position on Confederate monuments from one of the affected locality involved to one where all should be removed from public places. But not one mention of the State Police contradicting McAuliffe’s claims about hidden gun caches and the State Police being under-armed. And this is from the newspaper that ran umpteen stories about George Allen and his stupid macacca remarks. This is an attempted cover-up of news that does not advance the Post’s agenda.

      I’ve also been told by a Post reporter (who still works for the company) that he received pressure from the Editorial staff not to write any critical stories about then-Governor Tim Kaine.

      The MSM is as corrupt and unprincipled as Trump appears to be. And now it appears Terry McAuliffe is too.

      1. LarrytheG Avatar
        LarrytheG

        Is the RTD corrupt TMT?

        1. TooManyTaxes Avatar
          TooManyTaxes

          Larry, I don’t know anything about the RTD. I cannot judge.

          What’s the difference between the Washington Post and Pravda? Both have suppressed news they don’t like.

          1. LarrytheG Avatar
            LarrytheG

            RTD is Richmond TImes Dispatch and i’m asking you if you consider it to be like the Wash Post or Pravda? Do you think RTD “suppressed” news? Do you think Brietbart, Daily Caller, and company “suppress” news?

            how would you know?

          2. TooManyTaxes Avatar
            TooManyTaxes

            As I wrote, I’m not familiar with the Times Dispatch. I am familiar with the Post. It suppresses information that is not consistent with its views on issues. From what I’ve read about the Soviet government, Pravda did the same thing. Isn’t that why the U.S. government started Radio Free Europe?

            With all of Governor Terry McAuliffe’s visibility on the C’ville situation, don’t you think it’s bona fide news that the State Police contradicted his statements on what happened in C’ville?

            I’m not painting every Post writer as corrupt, but there is a level of ideological corruption. If news doesn’t fit the agenda – promoting the Democratic Party and its agenda, news is suppressed.

          3. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
            Reed Fawell 3rd

            Between May and September of 2011 the Washington Post went after the Republican Speaker of the House in the run up to the budget debt fight after they won the Congress in the late 2010 landslide election.

            I followed the Post coverage for those 4.5 months comprising 25 articles published in all sections of the paper by some 15 different writers. I copied out quotes line for line from those 25 articles in chronological order, showing the intricate coordination by a particular powerful Post editor who was directing the reporters in his effort to smear the Speaker while glorifying Nancy Pelosi and Obama, and giving laughable opinions on the bad economic impact of the proposed budget cuts by a partisan hack reporter who earlier had reported the political news from Annapolis Md.

            The compiled result was astounding and often comical – The Speaker said to be abusing children’s programs next to a glowing article about Obama entertaining Boy Scouts at the White House, for example. Or photos of the Speaker looking crooked as an unshaven Richard Nixon next to a photo of Nancy Pelosi striding out smiling and gay, looking like she was 32 years old, after she had lost the largest House landslide in American history.

            I sent this 29 page single space compilation of only their own printed words that read like a screenplay to the Ombudsman, and several other reporters there that I knew and respected. They were struck dump and speechless.

            When the Post did the same thing during the Trayvon Martin affair, all in coordination with an outside Democratic hit Group, all which I again proved simply on the basis of feeding back to them the printed words of the slur campaign, I quit reading the paper, but for special occasions.

            What is a great disappointment to me is that I now feel very confident the the news section of the WSJ is doing the very same bogus but coordinated smear campaigns, stringing rumors, bad journalism and omissions of key fact together to achieve their own political ends.

            It is a mess this nation is in.

          4. TooManyTaxes Avatar
            TooManyTaxes

            I did finally find an MSM article that discusses McAuliffe and the state police. And it was in the Richmond Times Dispatch – a news outlet I don’t read regularly. But still nothing else in the MSM.

            http://www.richmond.com/news/virginia/virginia-state-police-mcauliffe-mistaken-in-comment-on-stashed-weapons/article_ad0fac2e-c56e-5c3e-92c0-ed570f250256.html?modalid=followed-notification-modal-e8fa39c8-e4de-11e6-919a-5cb9017bdf7b

            The WaPo continues every day with one or more article on C’ville and its aftermath. No problem with that. But where is the article on McAuliffe being contradicted by the State Police on two critical statements he made? Self-censorship. The Post represses news that doesn’t agree with its beliefs on issues. Just like Pravda.

            The media gets no respect, because it doesn’t deserve it. These are corrupt people who are repressing news as they proclaim they are reporting it.

  2. Andrew Roesell Avatar
    Andrew Roesell

    Dear Jim,

    The sense in the President’s words is not paradoxical: “Uniting the Right” means bringing various people together, people who feel that a “raging” Liberalism is a threat to our country. Such coalitions are always are unstable and uneasy. Over the years, I have attended intellectual Rightwing conferences of up to 200 people in which BOTH Jews AND some Neo-Nazis were present, and other people. But most of the people who attended were neither Jews nor Nazis, and probably none were both at the same time! The attitude of the participants toward these “friendly hostiles,” myself included, was one of polite avoidance. We were there to listen, to ask questions of the speakers and panels, to network, and it was just “one of those things” that those “other people” were there, too. In recent years, too, it has become nearly impossible to stage such events in commercial settings due to broken contracts and “Anti-Fa” threats.

    Having said that, I would not hazard to put a percentage on the extremists present at the rally in Charlottesville.

    Let’s face it, the Democratic also is made up of a disparate alliance of Liberals, moderates, Democratic Socialists, and Communists. It’s sad, but that’s politics. I once knew a Professor in my undergraduate schooling who was a Communist, I had tried forming a Democratic Socialist, “Michael Harrington Club,” and he told me of his like-minded son. He told him that whatever his convictions, his son should “buy his clothes at Brooks Brothers so that people will even listen to you.” I had wanted this professor to sponsor my group and did not realize just how far to the Left he “swung” going in.

    Remember, too, that in order to take down Adolf Hitler, the U.S. allied itself with, arguably, an even greater mass murderer, Joseph Stalin, whom FDR dubbed, “Uncle Joe.” And that went on for several years, and the Liberal New York Times happily overlooked and denied his many crimes, until after 1945, when, it was “politically necessary” to bring them up. This pattern of aligning with evil men when it suits policy interests is ubiquitous in U.S. foreign policy. So, let’s put things in some perspective. This “virgin” lost her “maidenhead” long, long ago! To speak otherwise is either naive or disingenuous.

    Sincerely,

    Andrew

  3. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
    Reed Fawell 3rd

    What are witnessing the unfolding of a terrible event, a hysteria fueled by political maneuvers that could dwarf the Dreyfus Affair that rocked and divided France from 18g4 to 1906. There is growing level of irresponsibility among this nations leaders within all levels of our institutions, public and private, that is shocking. Much is at stake, and its a highly combustible mix – ideology, money, class, grievance and power, perhaps now irreconcilable. The US military must stay above the fray as I expect and hope it will, given its current quality.

  4. LarrytheG Avatar
    LarrytheG

    re: ” With all of Governor Terry McAuliffe’s visibility on the C’ville situation, don’t you think it’s bona fide news that the State Police contradicted his statements on what happened in C’ville?”

    Here’s what I think TMT – that the GOv pretty much accorded himself well and perhaps not perfect and with a misstep on this issue.. but the ONLY folks who are “reporting” it are the Breitbarts and Daily Callers and Free Beacon – it’s a red flag.

    and I do worry about folks who base their views about what they read in Breitbart and discount other sources.. sorry.. you have to WANT to read a wide variety of sources – AND understand that ALL reporting from ALL sources IS subject to less than 100% accuracy.. I do NOT trust ANY source and especially so when what is reported tends to run like wildlife – almost to the word through the right-wing media sites..

    and you should too, guy..

    McAuliffe is a politician.. and I’ve yet to see a single one left or right that is not caught on their own petard from time to time – you just cannot be a public figure whose every word is captured and not get tangled up at times.

    the question is – is a once in a while or is it a continuing daily/weekly pattern about a variety of issues..

    if you are waiting and “primed” for every misstep and your truth model is Breitbart and company.. sorry guy.. that’s a fail.

    1. TooManyTaxes Avatar
      TooManyTaxes

      Larry, you are dodging the issue. The Post and other traditional or MSM outlets have ignored the story. Since they refuse to write and publish an article on the Virginia State Police contradicting the Governor on two important issues, a reader cannot find any articles on their websites. The only sources are ones you question. It’s not about people ignoring traditional sources for what some believe to be more sketchy ones. It’s about the Post suppressing news that is inconsistent with its beliefs.

      It’s like Pravda. It didn’t report about the failures of the many Five Year Plans. One had to learn about failures from other sources. Sources the Soviets would condemn as unreliable.

      Think about this. The MSM suppresses news. For this they should be respected? It’s indefensible.

      1. LarrytheG Avatar
        LarrytheG

        @TMT – getting your “news” from Brietbart is not a solution to MSM..

        every news organization – including Briebart “ignores” stories..

        for you to use a standard where you discount WaPo and prefer Brietbart.. that’s a fail.. guy.. you’r not going to get the facts.. only things to confirm your own biases..

        I suspect that McAulife did mess up but I judge him not on one thing.. and I’m not waiting until one thing upon which I will then judge him .. if you do that – there is not a single politician upon which you would trust for anything.. and if that’s what you do then why read the news in the first place?

        There is no dodging here. if you want “news” you have to read a lot of different sources and not restrict yourself to ones that have a reputation like Brietbart has – which is far worse than WaPo..

        and this is on top of a post a while back where you referenced InfoWars..
        geeze guy..

        1. TooManyTaxes Avatar
          TooManyTaxes

          Larry, if the turds at the WaPo reported important developments on this issue, I wouldn’t need to look at other sources. Again, my friend, search for “McAuliffe” & “gun cache” or “weapons cache,” and see what your search comes up with. A number of links to articles, but no “traditional media.”

          I’d be happy to refer to a TV, radio stations, cable network or newspaper, but they didn’t report on it. And I submit that, given McAuliffe’s visibility on the issue and remarks, this is news.

          It’s an MSM cover-up. Just like Pravda used to do.

          These folks in the MSM are not good people. They have no fealty to so-called ethics of journalism. They are no different than Brietbart, etc. They just sing from a different hymnal.

    2. TooManyTaxes Avatar
      TooManyTaxes

      Larry, McAuliffe did not accord himself well at C’ville. First, he lied to the public on the extent of weapons possessed by the violent people on the right and on the armament of the police (and, hence, the preparedness of the Commonwealth to defend and protect people and property). Not enough state resources, including an National Guard units, to support the City’s efforts. Complaints were made from all parties.

      He also allowed the police to stand down. Here’s a link to that from the Clinton News Network. http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/14/us/police-response-charlottesville-trnd/index.html

      Here’s is a quote from a Washington Post reporter from the Los Angeles Times. Washington Post reporter Joe Heim: “Counter-protesters fought back, also swinging sticks, punching and spraying chemicals. Others threw balloons filled with paint or ink at the white nationalists. Everywhere, it seemed violence was exploding. The police did not move to break up the fights.” http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-charlottesville-witnesses-20170815-story.html

      As I wrote earlier, I think McAuliffe would do better next time, if there is ever a next time. But the Governor did not do a good job and also mislead the public on important issues.

  5. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
    Reed Fawell 3rd

    Here is a corrected version to my earlier comment now erased:

    UVA has been flooding my in box with emails for more than a week. Each UVA email says the same thing, over and over again, in slightly altered form as if a contrived Madison Avenue advertisement campaign:

    Urgent protestations, announcements, proclamations and claims from the UVa.’s President, UVa.’s Rector, UVa.’s Alumni Association, UVa.’s Miller Center, UVa. Magazine and UVa. Daily and now from student leaders, all shouting almost the same thing:

    “We have been invaded by the evil of white nationalists and white supremacist terrorism. But we will not be intimated and we stand in solidarity and virtue instead. Hate has no place here. We choose Love.”

    That is the tenor of the main message. The underlying message is also clear and unambiguous, namely that:

    UVa., an innocent victim, has found the devil it so desperately needs to deflect attention away from itself – and onto more white men to demonize instead – this time Fascists and Neo-Nazi white supremacists from out of town. UVA thus grabs the perfect target to stand in solidarity against, and to hate, so as to falsely claim to heal the violation of UVa.’s virtuous and loving community, while UVA compounds and deepens the problem instead.

    How easy it is to hate white fascists neo-Nazi white supremacists. I want to hate them too, who does not? But where is the wisdom and maturity in that?

    How easy and convenient it is to claim the violation of one’s innocence by the evil white man in Charlottesville. How good and reassuring of one’s own virtue it is to hate the Other. Particularly during these feverish times in C’ville Virginia, and all over the nation. It’s the 1930’s in Germany all over again, this time playing out on the Grounds of Mr. Jefferson’s University.

    How habit forming it was then and is here now to hate and demonize others rather than to understand and forgive and to confront other harsh facts that compounded this tragedy, including one’s own faults that require serious introspection and correction. How easy it is to avoid introspection and self- examination by holding endless mass torch lit rallies to build group emotional solidarity with the thousands of vulnerable and malleable young students in your care instead of doing the hard work of effective leadership.

    This running away from reality and this constant circling of wagons against the OTHER, this closing of a university’s collective mind – this is the sure sign of an unhealthy community dependent on mass hysteria to hold itself together against adversity and different opinions and kinds of people.

    Making it worse is that those who are tasked to instruct and lead UVA students are manipulating their students instead. Imagine it. The people whose sacred obligation at UVA is teach their student’s introspection, rational thought, and the rich complexities of their past, and thereby tasked to encourage their students’ emotional and spiritual growth, these professors and Administrators and Board are actively engaged in doing precisely the reverse, turning their students back into ill tempered and overly wrought children unable to confront their rightful future

    I am reminded of the Jackie controversy. All its pain, deceit, and confusion.

    The Jackie controversy, best I can discern, was born and nurtured within the hot house of the now chronic hysteria at UVa. Back then, in 2014 as I recall, UVa. leaders also madly rushed out onto the Grounds to proclaim their solidarity with their students by demonizing a group of UVa. students.

    That time it was WHITE FRATERNITY BOYS. Thus UVa.’s leaders hoped to shift all the blame for Jackie’s violation onto an ENTIRE group on campus. One they thought they could easily demonize so as to avoid confronting the real problems at UVa., and feed their own twisted bias at the same time, while escaping all responsibility for their own negligence that in substantial part caused then fueled the controversy in the first place.

    What were those real but hidden problems? The hysteria, particularly among young women students, brought on directly by a rampant hook-up sex culture that had infected UVa.’s student body for decades. A plague that UVa. leadership had refused to confront and deal with for decades.

    Now it is all happening again. This chronic failure of mature courageous leadership to see, appreciate, understand, and properly deal with, the real issues that afflict Mr. Jefferson’s academic village. The deep seated problems that UVA’s leadership has not only allowed to infect, but has too often encouraged to feaster, for so long to the great detriment of its students.

    It is all quite remarkable.

    UVa. still cannot honestly confront its problems. Instead its leaders manipulate their own students – young men and women who struggle daily to learn how the think clearly for themselves, so that they might stand up as strong and independent young adults, young people who have been liberated from hysteria’s self destructive and childish acts.

    And now, here this time, it happens all over again. For example:

    Why does UVa. hide the disorderly group of students who, yelling obscenities, pushed and shoved their way into a Board of Visitors meeting recently, demanding that Thomas Jefferson’s statute be removed from the Grounds of UVa?

    Why no consequences for this mob?

    Or for the professors who taught them?

    Or the endless obsessive wailing and preening over slavery ended by a Civil War the killed on 600,000 Americans 150+ years ago.

    Is hate or twisted versions of history being preached in the classrooms at UVA?

    Instead of asking these questions and acting like effective leaders must, UVa. officials fired one of the police officers who quelled the disturbance. What was his offense? As best I can tell, his offense was that he was a white man security guard who uttered the words “Make America Great Again.”

    Wake up UVa!

    What do those recent events in and outside your board room have to do with last weekend’s riot, including their impact on the local police, as well as on your own students who surely were involved in the fracas.

    Love, virtue, and understanding, is not happening in Charlottesville.

    Nor is it happening at UVa. Where are its leaders? Why can’t they and their students act like the grownups did in Charleston, South Carolina.

  6. Peter Galuszka Avatar
    Peter Galuszka

    Reed,
    I try not to comment too much on this blog, but I think you are conflating a bunch of unconnected things about UVA. I am not a UVA grad but I guess I am part of the community because I am a former Hoo parent and have a weekly news analysis program on WTJU radio at the school.
    First, let’s talk about Jackie and Rolling Stone. What really happened is that a free lance journalist who had written a bit for Rolling Stone pitched a story idea about exploring the hook-up, drunken rape-ridden culture that exists at many universities. They came up with a narrative and then searched the country to find a college that fit the mold. They could have chosen Dartmouth, Berkeley, Michigan, Florida, anywhere. But some how they chose UVA thanks to “Jackie.” As we now know the story was bogus. It wasn’t as if Jackie went to Rolling Stone with her story. Rolling Stone went to her with their already scripted out narrative. And that is why they lost their libel suits.
    It isn’t right for you to somehow conflate the alleged frat boy culture with the white supremacists and their bloody rally. I’m not sure what your point is. I would think the hookup culture is there is you want it and not everyone wants it. When my daughter was a freshman she went to some frat rush parties and quickly decided that it wasn’t for her and she was able to find a social life she preferred.
    So what if you get material from the university? They are right to not try to pretend the Nazis aren’t there. They are offering alternative ways to show opinion.
    Once again, I am becoming more and more disenchanted with Bacons Rebellion these days. There are calls for probes of McAuliffe who was wrong about caches of weapons. So what? What bugs me is why these self-styled “militia” creeps were allowed to run around with assault rifles. If they tried it at public demonstrations in Maryland or DC they’d be in jail. No one questions that here. Instead we get a bunch of false equivalencies and harrumphs on this blog

  7. LarrytheG Avatar
    LarrytheG

    re: ” Why can’t they and their students act like the grownups did in Charleston, South Carolina.”

    perhaps I’m unfamiliar but what did the gownups in Charleston do that was admired?

    1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
      Reed Fawell 3rd

      Recall the white kid who went to a black church and prayed with the minister and members of the congregation before murdering them. And that this followed the terrible and unjustified shooting of the black man in the park by the policeman. Recall the grace, courage, honesty and maturity shown by everyone there, despite this horrible hate crime in one case, and what appeared at best to be gross negligence in the other.

  8. LarrytheG Avatar
    LarrytheG

    Okay, I get it..you’re talking about how all those folks got slaughtered and every kept their cool afterwards?

    doing that is “adult”?

    I dunno Reed.. I’m not feeling that.. I think it is remarkable that they did not react the more typical way ………. but I also think you may not appreciate just how much that event changed a lot of others in terms of standing by and leaving the neo nazi/KKK groups “alone” .. or that people like Roof is a “clown”… There are a lot of emotions but I don’t think many in the public realm see standing by like the folks in Charleston did -and the right behavior going forward..

    1. Reed Fawell 3rd Avatar
      Reed Fawell 3rd

      “For leadership we turn, as we always do anyway, to each other – to thinkers and respected colleagues, religious figures and neighbors. After the church shootings in Charleston, S.C. two years ago, the great and immediate moral leaders were the victim’s families whose words at the shooters bond hearing spread throughout the country within 24 hours. “I forgive you. We are praying for you.” It was the authentic voice of American Christianity, of Wednesday night Bible study, of mercy and self-sacrifice. It quieted the soul of the nation: We’ll be Okay. This is who we really are.

      Those bereaved relatives never quite got the recognition and thanks they deserved. Their love saved the day.”

      By Peggy Noonan, published this Saturday morning in Opinion section of WSJ, August 19, 2017.

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